/u/unounoseis now knows how those poor people forced to attend the pedo factor of PSU feel. It's not fair that they get slandered for being associated with an institution that hid child rape for years, I mean this was football after all! Who cares that some drunk WHORES got raped, Baylor was relevant for like 3 years in CFB! Don't they understand that's the real crime here? That all the rapes didn't even get them more than a loss in the fiesta bowl, it was all for nothing! A complete waste!
They really do have their priorities set straight. Most universities would cast a guy like Shawn Oakman aside after he was kicked out of Penn State for assaulting a dining hall worker when he was discovered stealing food. Not Art Briles and the Waco redeemers though.
Of course Oakman went on to batter a woman while he was a student at Baylor and then raped another on a trip to Waco after trying to take his talents to the NFL, but redemption is a worthy cause when you can contribute to an eleven win football season.
Also the problem for the universities is actually they are bit powerless to the whole ordeal. Like they are supposed start a private investigation into something where the only evidence is just a accusation.
They really should turn sexual assault allegations over to local law enforcement. I can understand wanting to keep minor property theft or vandalism or misdemeanor drug offenses in house, but violent crime needs to be treated more seriously on college campuses.
I'm not an american so I may just be missing culture differences in how universities work there, but why would you ever take up a non academic related issue to the uni rather than police? Especially if it was something as severe as rape. Surely getting the person charged/investigated by law enforcement will be 100% more effective than having uni administrators who aren't legal authorities to deal with it.
Also the problem for the universities is actually they are bit powerless to the whole ordeal. Like they are supposed start a private investigation into something where the only evidence is just a accusation.
When they try that it also turns into a witch hunt the other way depending on the University. This should be a 100% law enforcement thing.
Wait, so you think just because I didn't address the victims in my comment I don't care about them? Did you read what I said in my follow-up? Their situation is obviously way worse than mine or anyone else's, I've said that numerous times. I'm not trying to paint my second-hand problems as worse than any of the victims. I wanted Briles and everyone involved gone once the evidence was out there - I wanted a clean house, I wasn't one of those #CAB truthers you probably think I am. In reality, they were a very small minority of the school and were looked down upon by anyone with half a brain. I'm addressing the domino effect the administration's fuck up has on the rest of the people affiliated with Baylor. The possibility of losing accreditation would devalue our degrees and any professor's research. We hate the people who messed this up just as much as anyone, but that doesn't mean we can't have a valid concern over our own well-being which extends to our family's/future family's well-being. I'm sorry if my comment came off as me having a lack of empathy, that's entirely not true.
What about Kim Mulkey's comment in the post I linked? Outside of Pat Summit and Geno Auriemma, there's not a more regaled women's basketball coach in recent history. Mulkey is an institution, yet she's carrying water for your scumbag football program. Why?
I can understand circling the wagons, if let's say, one of your men's basketball players murders a teammate. That's a bad apple and not an institutional failure. Unfortunately when September rolls around, your stadium is going to be just as full as it was before this systemic culture of rape came to light and that's fucking shameful man.
The logic that because our fans will be at the game means that we support the administration is incredibly ignorant. Matt Rhule and his staff (except the pimp) have earned my respect so far as well as Mack Rhoades. I have close and personal friends on the football team as well as in the athletic office - I'm supporting their families who I have grown up with. I'm not going to turn my back on them, especially when they're innocent. These are the people I am supporting, and anyone in the stadium who still supports Briles and co. is blind.
I understand that Rhule and the players you know and support had nothing to do with the 52 alleged rapes, and the fact that you support them as people is commendable. You understand this goes beyond the people currently involved in Baylor football though right?
I honestly don't know how big Greek life is at Baylor, but let's say a fraternity had a four year history of rape by various brothers, many of whom were in league with one another to make sexual assaults more common. You know they would be kicked off of campus, sanctioned by the national organization and probably not allowed a seat on the fraternal council for at least a decade. Why does the football team get a pass? You and I both know the answer, and it's money.
I went to the public school about an hour and a half south of Waco on I-35, and my alma mater benefits when Baylor has robust athletic programs. This shit going on is inexcusable though, and nobody outside the Baylor community will ever think otherwise.
I don't think it's fair to compare a fraternity being suspended to an entire athletic department. A fraternity being suspended doesn't effect much outside of those in the chapter. Suspending the athletic department would put a lot of people out of jobs, students would lose scholarships causing them to relocate or possibly miss out on an education, current students would suffer from a social aspect and be looked down upon from potential employers. I agree with you that there needs be more punishment than what has already been handed down, but I also think it's important to get a fully restructured administration in swing before we hand out punishments.
every time this stuff comes to light and nothing happens because 'oh noes it would require a lot of work and money' it pretty much cements that it will happen again. But, sure, a couple rapes here and there are a small price to pay for helping people keep jobs and scholarships.
'current students would suffer from a social aspect and be looked down upon from potential employers'
wtf you on about? Yes, because when you list your university on your resume it's to let potential employers know which sports teams you may be tangentially related to. I know it's hard to understand, but universities were kind've meant to be a place of learning. That's what prospective employers look at not, hummagawd how good is the sports team where you went?
If you guys had anything else going for your school other than a few semi decent sports teams then people would have stopped caring a long time ago. PSU was able to walk past this fairly quick because it's still an excellent university.
For Baylor this was pretty much the only thing they had. So yeah, when you shit your only pair of pants people are going to talk about it until you buy a new pair.
But Baylor is an excellent university? Ranked 71 according to usnews.com where PSU is 50. For comparison, UT Austin is 56. If rankings aren't your thing, then do a little more research cause if the only thing you know about us is sports then your knowledge is pretty thin cause we've been pretty bad up until the last decade or so.
How long did it take you to look that up on US news?
Baylor is not an excellent university. It is a mediocre university. There's nothing inherently wrong with that, lots of good folks come from mediocre universities. But choosing to spend 4 times what a superior state school would cost for the joy of getting to live in....wait for it...Waco (whose 2 biggest claims to fame are Branch Davidians and biker gang shootouts)....that's not a good choice.
Unless of course you did it for religious reasons, which is fine. But then....I dunno what exactly does the Bible say about rape?
As for comparison to UT. Just...lol. Yeah, UT may only be 20 spots above it in ranking, but UT hits top 10-20 in so many of its schools that it's a national powerhouse. Same with Penn State.
What exactly is Baylor known for? Sports (and even then as you point out it's...questionable). So when something negative happens to the sports everyone starts crying. Same shit happens with University of Houston and Tom Herman. Bunch of babies.
And yet you don't hear the UT alumn belly aching left and right over their piss poor decade of sports performance (let's face it at this point they are probably just numb to it). But the main point is that their decision to go there was based on more important fundamentals than getting to wear a certain ball cap on the weekends.
Find something real to have pride in at your school. I'm sure it's there somewhere.
Old Testament can be pretty savage in regards to rape. A virgin that is not betrothed must marry her rapist and he must care for her all his days although she can request to be freed of the marriage even after a penalty has been paid to her father. If the woman is betrothed the rapist is put to death.
New Testament is much more in favor of the victim being free of their rapist in any situation. Jesus was all about helping the victims and the weakest of society. Early Christians had a very feminist-like culture. Just look at the power that Mother Superiors held for the first 1000 years or so. That seems to have lessened in the last millennium though, which I think is a shame.
And yet you don't hear the UT alumn belly aching left and right over their piss poor decade of sports performance (let's face it at this point they are probably just numb to it).
The Longhorn Network not being available on Comcast helps a lot of us cope.
"Alleged" rapes are such bullshit anyway. It's some college whore who spread syphilis through campus and then claimed rape when someone calls her out on being a filthy slut.
There's been plenty of college rape cases that turned out to be fabricated. Can't trust these godless Western whores. Muhammad (pbuh) warned against it.
That would likely have an unintentional side-effect of making women fear making real rape accusations as well (especially for situations in the "gray area", where the victim does not physically resist due to fear of being injured or killed by the attacker, and it is disputed whether those fears were justified in that situation). A better solution would probably be to require such accusations to be concealed from the public, so that they do not alter the public opinion prior to a conviction.
The vast majority of rapes have no witnesses, and if it's a gang rape type situation, the "witnesses" are likely to lie to protect their fellow rapists. "Witnesses" are only really a thing in rape if some idiot decides to rape someone literally in the middle of the street or something.
I'd say a better solution would be to encourage people to have closed-circuit video in their bedrooms that they could use as evidence, though obviously that would only provide evidence for rapes occurring in your own home.
How the fuck was Baylor not given the death penalty? How are dozens of gang rapes and the rape of children somehow less bad than Reggie Bush taking money without USC knowing?
The NCAA arguably doesn't have jurisdiction over a case like Baylor's. Remember, they tried to discipline Penn State and got the pants sued off them in response.
66 comments
n/a SnapshillBot 2017-02-27
Neat.
Snapshots:
I am a bot. (Info / Contact)
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
http://www.dallasnews.com/news/baylor/2017/01/27/new-baylor-lawsuit-describes-show-em-good-time-culture-cites-52-rapes-football-players-4-years
Literal rape culture at a "Baptist" university.
n/a shitsfuckedupalot 2017-02-27
Well god raped mary and then made her lie and tell everyone she was a virgin so that's not really incongruous with christian values
n/a MegaSeedsInYourBum 2017-02-27
It's so surprising right? Isn't it unheard of for people who claim piety to be the biggest degenerates out there?
n/a Sethal4395 2017-02-27
That's about all the explanation you need right there.
n/a JumbledFun 2017-02-27
/u/unounoseis now knows how those poor people forced to attend the pedo factor of PSU feel. It's not fair that they get slandered for being associated with an institution that hid child rape for years, I mean this was football after all! Who cares that some drunk WHORES got raped, Baylor was relevant for like 3 years in CFB! Don't they understand that's the real crime here? That all the rapes didn't even get them more than a loss in the fiesta bowl, it was all for nothing! A complete waste!
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
They really do have their priorities set straight. Most universities would cast a guy like Shawn Oakman aside after he was kicked out of Penn State for assaulting a dining hall worker when he was discovered stealing food. Not Art Briles and the Waco redeemers though.
Of course Oakman went on to batter a woman while he was a student at Baylor and then raped another on a trip to Waco after trying to take his talents to the NFL, but redemption is a worthy cause when you can contribute to an eleven win football season.
n/a Minimum_T-Giraff 2017-02-27
Also the problem for the universities is actually they are bit powerless to the whole ordeal. Like they are supposed start a private investigation into something where the only evidence is just a accusation.
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
They really should turn sexual assault allegations over to local law enforcement. I can understand wanting to keep minor property theft or vandalism or misdemeanor drug offenses in house, but violent crime needs to be treated more seriously on college campuses.
n/a Minimum_T-Giraff 2017-02-27
In truth the victims should turn over to Police instead of some university administrator that has zero skills to deal with the situation.
What do you really expect from bunch of pen-pushers that are unskilled and unqualified to handle the situation?
But then again i don't understand why universities does simply turn over the affair to the police instead of pretending to doing something useful.
n/a BigPeeOn 2017-02-27
Um, because then they can't cover up the rapes. Duh.
n/a yodren 2017-02-27
I'm not an american so I may just be missing culture differences in how universities work there, but why would you ever take up a non academic related issue to the uni rather than police? Especially if it was something as severe as rape. Surely getting the person charged/investigated by law enforcement will be 100% more effective than having uni administrators who aren't legal authorities to deal with it.
n/a Chicup 2017-02-27
When they try that it also turns into a witch hunt the other way depending on the University. This should be a 100% law enforcement thing.
n/a Nomadlads 2017-02-27
Colleges are in a weird position. They can kick you out for very little evidence, but they're still woefully ineffective.
n/a Clark_Savage_Jr 2017-02-27
Who steals food from a dining hall?
At least in quantities that upset the staff.
n/a nmx179 2017-02-27
/u/Penguinverse way to use a bunch if rapes you don't really care about as the excuse you need to be a sneering superior asshole I guess.
n/a Time_to_Drink 2017-02-27
Butt meets hurt
n/a nmx179 2017-02-27
Ebin meme
n/a unounoseis 2017-02-27
Wait, so you think just because I didn't address the victims in my comment I don't care about them? Did you read what I said in my follow-up? Their situation is obviously way worse than mine or anyone else's, I've said that numerous times. I'm not trying to paint my second-hand problems as worse than any of the victims. I wanted Briles and everyone involved gone once the evidence was out there - I wanted a clean house, I wasn't one of those #CAB truthers you probably think I am. In reality, they were a very small minority of the school and were looked down upon by anyone with half a brain. I'm addressing the domino effect the administration's fuck up has on the rest of the people affiliated with Baylor. The possibility of losing accreditation would devalue our degrees and any professor's research. We hate the people who messed this up just as much as anyone, but that doesn't mean we can't have a valid concern over our own well-being which extends to our family's/future family's well-being. I'm sorry if my comment came off as me having a lack of empathy, that's entirely not true.
n/a pepperouchau 2017-02-27
Glad you could come out and admit it.
n/a Pablopubes 2017-02-27
Fuckin got 'em
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
What about Kim Mulkey's comment in the post I linked? Outside of Pat Summit and Geno Auriemma, there's not a more regaled women's basketball coach in recent history. Mulkey is an institution, yet she's carrying water for your scumbag football program. Why?
I can understand circling the wagons, if let's say, one of your men's basketball players murders a teammate. That's a bad apple and not an institutional failure. Unfortunately when September rolls around, your stadium is going to be just as full as it was before this systemic culture of rape came to light and that's fucking shameful man.
n/a CucksLoveTrump 2017-02-27
Didn't this happen at Baylor too?
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
I wouldn't get that specific if it didn't!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Patrick_Dennehy
n/a HelperBot_ 2017-02-27
Non-Mobile link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Patrick_Dennehy
HelperBot v1.1 /r/HelperBot_ I am a bot. Please message /u/swim1929 with any feedback and/or hate. Counter: 37280
n/a unounoseis 2017-02-27
The logic that because our fans will be at the game means that we support the administration is incredibly ignorant. Matt Rhule and his staff (except the pimp) have earned my respect so far as well as Mack Rhoades. I have close and personal friends on the football team as well as in the athletic office - I'm supporting their families who I have grown up with. I'm not going to turn my back on them, especially when they're innocent. These are the people I am supporting, and anyone in the stadium who still supports Briles and co. is blind.
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
I understand that Rhule and the players you know and support had nothing to do with the 52 alleged rapes, and the fact that you support them as people is commendable. You understand this goes beyond the people currently involved in Baylor football though right?
I honestly don't know how big Greek life is at Baylor, but let's say a fraternity had a four year history of rape by various brothers, many of whom were in league with one another to make sexual assaults more common. You know they would be kicked off of campus, sanctioned by the national organization and probably not allowed a seat on the fraternal council for at least a decade. Why does the football team get a pass? You and I both know the answer, and it's money.
I went to the public school about an hour and a half south of Waco on I-35, and my alma mater benefits when Baylor has robust athletic programs. This shit going on is inexcusable though, and nobody outside the Baylor community will ever think otherwise.
n/a unounoseis 2017-02-27
I don't think it's fair to compare a fraternity being suspended to an entire athletic department. A fraternity being suspended doesn't effect much outside of those in the chapter. Suspending the athletic department would put a lot of people out of jobs, students would lose scholarships causing them to relocate or possibly miss out on an education, current students would suffer from a social aspect and be looked down upon from potential employers. I agree with you that there needs be more punishment than what has already been handed down, but I also think it's important to get a fully restructured administration in swing before we hand out punishments.
n/a neutralvoter 2017-02-27
every time this stuff comes to light and nothing happens because 'oh noes it would require a lot of work and money' it pretty much cements that it will happen again. But, sure, a couple rapes here and there are a small price to pay for helping people keep jobs and scholarships.
'current students would suffer from a social aspect and be looked down upon from potential employers'
wtf you on about? Yes, because when you list your university on your resume it's to let potential employers know which sports teams you may be tangentially related to. I know it's hard to understand, but universities were kind've meant to be a place of learning. That's what prospective employers look at not, hummagawd how good is the sports team where you went?
n/a SamWhite 2017-02-27
You're fucking scum.
n/a Hellkyte 2017-02-27
If you guys had anything else going for your school other than a few semi decent sports teams then people would have stopped caring a long time ago. PSU was able to walk past this fairly quick because it's still an excellent university.
For Baylor this was pretty much the only thing they had. So yeah, when you shit your only pair of pants people are going to talk about it until you buy a new pair.
n/a unounoseis 2017-02-27
But Baylor is an excellent university? Ranked 71 according to usnews.com where PSU is 50. For comparison, UT Austin is 56. If rankings aren't your thing, then do a little more research cause if the only thing you know about us is sports then your knowledge is pretty thin cause we've been pretty bad up until the last decade or so.
n/a Hellkyte 2017-02-27
How long did it take you to look that up on US news?
Baylor is not an excellent university. It is a mediocre university. There's nothing inherently wrong with that, lots of good folks come from mediocre universities. But choosing to spend 4 times what a superior state school would cost for the joy of getting to live in....wait for it...Waco (whose 2 biggest claims to fame are Branch Davidians and biker gang shootouts)....that's not a good choice.
Unless of course you did it for religious reasons, which is fine. But then....I dunno what exactly does the Bible say about rape?
As for comparison to UT. Just...lol. Yeah, UT may only be 20 spots above it in ranking, but UT hits top 10-20 in so many of its schools that it's a national powerhouse. Same with Penn State.
What exactly is Baylor known for? Sports (and even then as you point out it's...questionable). So when something negative happens to the sports everyone starts crying. Same shit happens with University of Houston and Tom Herman. Bunch of babies.
And yet you don't hear the UT alumn belly aching left and right over their piss poor decade of sports performance (let's face it at this point they are probably just numb to it). But the main point is that their decision to go there was based on more important fundamentals than getting to wear a certain ball cap on the weekends.
Find something real to have pride in at your school. I'm sure it's there somewhere.
n/a ssjkriccolo 2017-02-27
Old Testament can be pretty savage in regards to rape. A virgin that is not betrothed must marry her rapist and he must care for her all his days although she can request to be freed of the marriage even after a penalty has been paid to her father. If the woman is betrothed the rapist is put to death.
New Testament is much more in favor of the victim being free of their rapist in any situation. Jesus was all about helping the victims and the weakest of society. Early Christians had a very feminist-like culture. Just look at the power that Mother Superiors held for the first 1000 years or so. That seems to have lessened in the last millennium though, which I think is a shame.
https://www.openbible.info/topics/rape
n/a Time_to_Drink 2017-02-27
Feminazi plz go
n/a StormStooper 2017-02-27
Ohhhh shit, this thread is discussing how good of a university Baylor is and how hard of a stance the Old/New Testament has on rape.
Quality /r/Drama material
n/a pm_me_pics_of_ur_nan 2017-02-27
The Longhorn Network not being available on Comcast helps a lot of us cope.
n/a YourGayOpinion 2017-02-27
White sorority girls always freak out and allege rape after they sober up and realize they fucked a black athlete.
n/a TheHeroReditDeserves 2017-02-27
spicy
n/a YourGayOpinion 2017-02-27
It is racism disguised as "feminism".
n/a TheHeroReditDeserves 2017-02-27
in their defence I think if you realized you had AIDS you would probably not be very happy about it either
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
"Alleged" rapes are such bullshit anyway. It's some college whore who spread syphilis through campus and then claimed rape when someone calls her out on being a filthy slut.
n/a Hemic 2017-02-27
Big if true. Good to see we have such a dedicated journalist to investigate this
n/a cimarafa 2017-02-27
big coming from our confirmed rapist
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
I've never been accused of rape, tho
n/a UncleSamuel 2017-02-27
https://i.imgur.com/OdsxPpF.png
-UncleSamuel
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
He's right about Paki's, even though i'm not a Paki.
At least i've got that
n/a Pablopubes 2017-02-27
That would require actual contact with a women, though.
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
No, it would require them being undrugged
n/a uptotwentycharacters 2017-02-27
Literally every crime is "alleged" until it is proven.
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
There's been plenty of college rape cases that turned out to be fabricated. Can't trust these godless Western whores. Muhammad (pbuh) warned against it.
n/a uptotwentycharacters 2017-02-27
Hence the term "alleged".
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
Hey they still had their lives ruined
n/a uptotwentycharacters 2017-02-27
We cannot legislate against thoughtcrime.
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
Then we must bully and intimidate women to such a degree, that they will not even dare to think of making false rape accusations.
n/a uptotwentycharacters 2017-02-27
That would likely have an unintentional side-effect of making women fear making real rape accusations as well (especially for situations in the "gray area", where the victim does not physically resist due to fear of being injured or killed by the attacker, and it is disputed whether those fears were justified in that situation). A better solution would probably be to require such accusations to be concealed from the public, so that they do not alter the public opinion prior to a conviction.
n/a Ultrashitpost 2017-02-27
I think the best solution would be to force women to produce 4 witnesses whenever they are raped.
n/a uptotwentycharacters 2017-02-27
The vast majority of rapes have no witnesses, and if it's a gang rape type situation, the "witnesses" are likely to lie to protect their fellow rapists. "Witnesses" are only really a thing in rape if some idiot decides to rape someone literally in the middle of the street or something.
I'd say a better solution would be to encourage people to have closed-circuit video in their bedrooms that they could use as evidence, though obviously that would only provide evidence for rapes occurring in your own home.
n/a cole1114 2017-02-27
How the fuck was Baylor not given the death penalty? How are dozens of gang rapes and the rape of children somehow less bad than Reggie Bush taking money without USC knowing?
n/a CucksLoveTrump 2017-02-27
NCAA moves slowly in investigations
n/a respaaaaaj 2017-02-27
I mean Penn state didn't get the death penalty and they're putting their fucking Paterno statues back up
n/a SithisTheDreadFather 2017-02-27
That's the million dollar question. The NCAA cares more about money (and cheap tattoos) than anything else.
n/a ryseing 2017-02-27
The NCAA arguably doesn't have jurisdiction over a case like Baylor's. Remember, they tried to discipline Penn State and got the pants sued off them in response.
n/a PicksOut4Harambe 2017-02-27
It's the damn BOMC at it again
n/a shitsfuckedupalot 2017-02-27
Man i want baylor to lose its accreditation. That would be soooo funny and sooo juicy.
n/a LSU_Coonass 2017-02-27
But did you know that Kim mulkey is kramer robinsons mom?
n/a glmox 2017-02-27
lol. "my bruised ego matters just as much as those women's bruised cervices! :(((("
n/a SpectroSpecter 2017-02-27
Beginning countdown until the lawsuit gets settled in private and no proof ever surfaces