It's cool to hate famous people that Reddit likes! I like the guy who when asked "why do you hate him personally and not just his fandom" replied with "because I hate this fandom." Right on, buddy!
Guy's a dick and treats his employees badly. He's little different than most other rich people in that regard, I don't single him out in particular but the circlejerk is pretty annoying too.
Making himself incredibly rich is not a good cause. It's silly to assume Silicon Valley billionaires care about much more than their own wealth, power & self-aggrandizement. This is the attitude that gets rightfully mocked.
If Superchargers are actually spread across the country, it could hurt the power of fossil fuels, and the leasing plan for solar panels makes them more cost efficient
We definitely should and it isn't innovation, but neither was the Model T. That being said, Henry Ford was a colossal dick, and Musk is nowhere near as great as a lot of people say he is
Well I can meet you halfway on this: I wouldn't single him out as an especially villainous character considering the 'competition' and I don't know why so many people do.
He's not outstanding in his practices, probably relatively tame compared to other fields such as sanitation, but what's really annoying is the hypocrisy in depicting him as this fighter for humanity when he is really not
But again, there aren't public programs doing this. So would you rather nothing at all get accomplished, because the government should be the ones doing it?
Is what Musk is doing even a net positive? There's a shit ton of resources going into his vanity projects at a time of great problems in our society. Even if it is, then I'll still criticize him for his exploitation and advocate for something better. Like, yeah, I'd rather capitalist production of wealth over living in caves, but that isn't going to shut me up.
There are greater problems, but there are always greater problems. I wouldn't get pissy with someone who volunteers at an animal shelter when they could be helping homeless people. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.
Maybe you're right, but the mythical public program you're referring to doesn't exist, and definitely won't exist until we are nearly at the point of no return when it comes to sustaining our way of life, if not later. Let's be realistic, the people or entities with the most power (political power and every other kind of power) are those with the most money, this is an indisputable fact, especially true in western society.
Since we're talking about an American company, we'll talk in terms of American economics and politics. Money equals power, and private companies and people who have the money necessary to pour into an endeavour that has a chance of changing the world for the better is our only chance for change. If that endeavour also makes the person who spearheaded said endeavour even richer, good for them, I don't see the problem with this.
And as far as the wage issues and working condition issues go, there are more reasons than money, etc. to make career choices. Some people work tirelessly for ideals, I'm not saying paychecks don't matter, but look at the history of the human race. Major technological advancements come at a cost, usually the biggest cost is tireless work from person(s) who believe in said cause and are willing to make huge sacrifices for the good of something bigger than themselves.
These people are not working in sweatshops, they are not being paid with a cup of rice per day, and they are absolutely free to go elsewhere if they aren't happy with their career or made a mistake in taking this job. Let's be realistic when we talk about the working conditions these people are enduring.
Oh yeah tell me more about how the billionaires are really so charitable and care about us so deeply.
They don't necessarily care about us so deeply. But they're human; being wealthy doesn't magically rob people of emotions like empathy, or anxiety about the future. Maybe it's all a vanity project, or maybe he's genuine and wants to make things better for humanity/reduce reliance on inefficient internal combustian engine, or maybe (shock horror) it's both. Either way, it's not necessarily a sign of maturity to assume anyone wealthy is a sociopath, even though many people (on reddit at least) insist otherwise.
capitalism is obviously inherently exploitative but there's still such a thing as actually liking your job, and anyone smart and qualified enough to get a job at spacex has the prospects and latitude to find such a job if they want to
They're paid less than in other comparable jobs, have to work longer hours, the bosses set unrealistic goals and they have higher than average turnover (but they deny this).
If you can make more, work less, and not contribute to Red Faction IRL then you're getting fucked over working for Musk.
Medical residents kill people if they fuck up, and they need to learn a lot of things quickly. I don't like people working 20 hour shifts, but if you're training to be a doctor then I don't see the problem with a few years of your life being very focused on work.
Actually the medical workload is the invention of an actual coke addicted workaholic. Like, the current idea of how long medical personnel needs to work is based on the steady consumption of stimulants (Most notably cocaine).
I think that a heavy workload (i.e being busy, not to the point of physical exhaustion any one day, but having to work most days for an extended period of time) is a good thing for doctors in training so they can learn best practices ASAP.
The point of physical exhausting is damn well reached most days.
Medical residents work up to 130 hours a week (Although most "Just" get between 80-100 hours a week), and a good portion of that is just paperwork.
How much of a better doctor do you think someone is going to be after 12 straight hours of paperwork?
The point here is that doctors are crippling their health and their ability to improve, to live up to the energy levels of a coke fiend workaholic, in order to dedicate about 40% of their time to paperwork and similar.
That's not a good reason, and they're not really helping anyone.
I absolutely agree that new doctors need to work a lot, it's part of the reason why many schools start them off working at the hospital from year 1 of medical school.
I mean they can just not work there if it's so bad. Wageslave blah blah blah but it not like your average spacex employee would be struggling to put food on the table or find another good job. Why do you hate voluntary transactions so much.
It's definitely true that we aren't talking about people who have few other options and are living paycheck to paycheck, which makes the libertarian "but it's voluntary!!!" bullshit a little less stupid. However bad working conditions are not something I want to see at any wage level. Exploitation at higher wages is still, you know, exploitation. Am I gonna spend my time fighting that as opposed to throwing my lot in with the Fight for 15 people? Probably not.
Eh, people chose that job. They knew how bad it would be, but something was worth it for them. If it really wasn't worth it. they wouldn't have the best minds, no?
And where do you suggest they go that is a "good job"? We're assuming that the reason SpaceX is a "bad job" is because of the extremely high work hours and lack of fair compensation for extra hours back. It's like that everywhere these days, you know. Direct result of capitalism.
People who are qualified to work at spacex have extremely good outside options. People with good options have good choices, they chose to work at a prestigious exciting job with high pay in exchange for long hours, and they could give up some of those things in exchange lower hours. It's like a big law attorney; they can work 80 hours per week, make partner and make millions, or they can be the in house lawyer for some company, be easily upper middle class, and work 40 hours per week.
I don't know. The first one about the lawsuit seems a bit silly. I don't doubt the guy was overworked, but to use that as an example of why Musk is a bad guy is a little ridiculous. Musk is probably not the guy's direct boss, and probably doesn't even know him. It's entirely possible this guy had a manager that was being unreasonable. I wouldn't be surprised if Musk didn't know anyone at that facility. Also, "case still pending"? I guess the Internet has already reached their judgement, eh?
Lots of people have shitty bosses. Hell, my boss is a fucking jackass. He's not a bad person--just a shitty manager.
You're just jealous, because you hate people who actually made something of themselves, it proves to you that you didn't fail because of external circumstance, you failed because you're a weak person /u/Prince_Kropotkin and you deserved to fail
Love the comment that's like "all he's done is provide huge budgets and overwork employees" and I'm like.....yeah that's definitely small potatoes with the budget.
Dude tried to slip that actually major accomplishment past everyone. Sly dog
I mean it might be one thing if Musk was fucking off to play golf, but when all of the top management has to work 100 hours a week with no weekends off. It doesn't seem as bad to me.
Thats not what Im saying, goy. There has never, and will never* be a society without classes where everyone is treated equally or whatever the fuck. You can have places where people have different attitudes towards being classcucked, but the end result is generally the same.
*unless you're in a utopic, post-scarcity society.
These are highly qualified and educated professionals. If they didn't wanna slavishly slobber all over Musk's cock and work so much, they could easily make a killing elsewhere. They're free to leave.
Yea but when you say bad working conditions its not like theyre getting their hands chopped off by a spinning jenny or bringing their kids to work so they can crawl inside the machines to clean them out, yea working extra hours sucks but its not like its some crime against humanity
This guy has the attracted every technically brilliant person willing to work behind him in his dream like moths to a flame. But 4 working rights lawsuits dont lie. "Not enough of you are working Saturdays." doesn't lie. Over the long term hes exploiting his workers for the brightest years. If you drop out, well, he has 40 000 people fighting for your job.
I guess I dont really like Elon Musk but theres nothing that really sets him apart from other asshole billionaires. I dont get why theres a special hateboner for him.
It's the hypocrisy between exploiting the labor of thousands of employees and shady shit in general when it comes to securing their capital while simultaneously presenting yourself as some weird freedom fighter for humanity. The smugness and arrogance just gets to my head
Bill Gates was basically the Stalin of the tech world in the 80s and 90s. But by having no compeition it really helped all of us in the end. Plus he then used his money to help out people in the 3rd world.
So did he destroy the lives of a lot of people in the US? of course, but in the end it was good for everyone
before he did that he destroyed a lot of other people with bullshit business tactics.
The only people he 'destroyed' were wealthy silicon valley types, by being a better businessman and frankly just having a better product than things like PS/2 which were available at the time. Boo fucking hoo.
Nice charity work, but let's not forget where all that money comes from. He didn't create it out of nothingness, he was and still is one of the most ruthless business man around, and in the process directly contributed to much off the suffering everywhere, in the developed world and in the underdeveloped world. This is what I mean about hypocrisy: The dude has a net worth close to 100 billion dollars and still accumulates wealth at a rapid pace, but because he gives a couple billion each year of that to projects like spreading GMO crop in Ghana or eradicating diseases, he's suddenly the good guy? You can't buy your way into heaven
again. the global 1% might hate him but do you really think anyone that isn't in that group gives a shit? do you think the people in Ghana that can't even prounounce his name much less know anything about him besides the fact that hes white cares about what the guy that is saving their lives did in the past?
Most of these seem trivial compared to the work of the Gates Foundation, and the overall value (jobs, productivity, taxable income etc..) created by Microsoft.
I meant liberal in the "lives under and is in endorsement of capitalist culture which breeds a sense of smugness and toxic political culture as part of its ideology". Everyone is guilty of it though, it's hard to completely remove yourself from ideology
Well I am bisexual but I prefer the jizz of others over my own. Mine's a little tart for my tastes. Also, I try not to be so messy when jacking off. Cleaning up messes is never fun.
Yeah, I find the whole the whole techno-visionary posture foolish and worthy of derision, and it's not a good thing the be exploiting workers, but leftist moralism does nothing to solve those problems. The issue isn't that corporations are willing to take advantage of loose market regulations -- they should be willing if they're to remain profitable -- the issue is that markets are mostly unregulated in the first place. You can try to shame CEOs and corporations into self-regulating all you want, but it's not going to happen, because the moment a corporation starts self-regulating it ceases to have an advantage over its competitors, starts loosing profits, and is quickly replaced by another corporation willing to take advantage.
It really shows the political naivety of a lot of these people that they think they can take the shaming tactics they've developed in the culture wars and apply them just as well to genuine political problems.
/u/HodorTheDoorHolder is the clear winner here. But in /u/Malevolent_USB_Drive's defense, being a communist in 2017 is so blatantly retarded that getting the upper hand on a 2017 communist is really no victory at all.
Every one of the comments by /u/malevolent_usb_drive were awful, just terrible. The worst! Please, I can't handle them they were so bad. Auuugh! That is me crying in pain for reading the comments 😷😷 ⬅ me sick from the disease you gave me with your abhorrent comments 🚮
I'm seeing a lot of people talking this "exploiting workers" meme, but nobody has cited any sources, starting to suspect it might be a malicious rumour or exaggeration.
To me, companies treating their employees like shit is usually a good indicator that they're willing to fuck over society at large as well, provided the right incentive, opportunity and cover story. Govts. you can change (allegedly), companies usually last. Especially when they have the govt. in their pocket as well. In itself, its not a big deal or something people should freak out about.
177 comments
n/a SnapshillBot 2017-03-04
Here's the thing. You said a "trilby is a fedora."
Snapshots:
I am a bot. (Info / Contact)
n/a my__name__is 2017-03-04
It's cool to hate famous people that Reddit likes! I like the guy who when asked "why do you hate him personally and not just his fandom" replied with "because I hate this fandom." Right on, buddy!
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
Really, how butthurt can you get about some dumb website
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
what a lame ass comment, fuck off to SRD where even the circlejerk about circlejerking gets circlejerked
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Guy's a dick and treats his employees badly. He's little different than most other rich people in that regard, I don't single him out in particular but the circlejerk is pretty annoying too.
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
Yeah, overworking is bad, although at least there's good salaries unlike with Bezos.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Making himself incredibly rich is not a good cause. It's silly to assume Silicon Valley billionaires care about much more than their own wealth, power & self-aggrandizement. This is the attitude that gets rightfully mocked.
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
I mean the environment stuff. At least the businesses will help some people
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Maybe, although I don't see much actual innovation or things a public program couldn't accomplish, just a lot of futurist hype and bullshitting.
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
If Superchargers are actually spread across the country, it could hurt the power of fossil fuels, and the leasing plan for solar panels makes them more cost efficient
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
It's not really innovation and we should have had a public program doing that already.
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
We definitely should and it isn't innovation, but neither was the Model T. That being said, Henry Ford was a colossal dick, and Musk is nowhere near as great as a lot of people say he is
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Well I can meet you halfway on this: I wouldn't single him out as an especially villainous character considering the 'competition' and I don't know why so many people do.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
He's not outstanding in his practices, probably relatively tame compared to other fields such as sanitation, but what's really annoying is the hypocrisy in depicting him as this fighter for humanity when he is really not
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
Definitely. He's a better-than-average businessman, not by any means Jesus or Hitler
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
Maybe, but right now there aren't public programs accomplishing this, so Musk is creating value.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Terrible way to frame it. Instead of seeing this as "we have an egomaniac-led, sub-par solution to a problem" you're saying "he's creating value!!!".
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
Everything is sub-par, anyone can come up with superior solutions from their armchair. A sub-par solution is still preferable to no solution.
n/a boozehelps 2017-03-04
But again, there aren't public programs doing this. So would you rather nothing at all get accomplished, because the government should be the ones doing it?
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Is what Musk is doing even a net positive? There's a shit ton of resources going into his vanity projects at a time of great problems in our society. Even if it is, then I'll still criticize him for his exploitation and advocate for something better. Like, yeah, I'd rather capitalist production of wealth over living in caves, but that isn't going to shut me up.
n/a boozehelps 2017-03-04
There are greater problems, but there are always greater problems. I wouldn't get pissy with someone who volunteers at an animal shelter when they could be helping homeless people. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
n/a boozehelps 2017-03-04
FFS. I guess God bless you for trying.
n/a dood98998 2017-03-04
You are the most optimistic negative person I've ever seen.
n/a aonome 2017-03-04
Lol he's taking steps to solve serious problems and you don't like it because he's doing it as a private business in a very libertarian manner.
Anarchism rots your brain
n/a AtomicWolf425 2017-03-04
Maybe you're right, but the mythical public program you're referring to doesn't exist, and definitely won't exist until we are nearly at the point of no return when it comes to sustaining our way of life, if not later. Let's be realistic, the people or entities with the most power (political power and every other kind of power) are those with the most money, this is an indisputable fact, especially true in western society.
Since we're talking about an American company, we'll talk in terms of American economics and politics. Money equals power, and private companies and people who have the money necessary to pour into an endeavour that has a chance of changing the world for the better is our only chance for change. If that endeavour also makes the person who spearheaded said endeavour even richer, good for them, I don't see the problem with this.
And as far as the wage issues and working condition issues go, there are more reasons than money, etc. to make career choices. Some people work tirelessly for ideals, I'm not saying paychecks don't matter, but look at the history of the human race. Major technological advancements come at a cost, usually the biggest cost is tireless work from person(s) who believe in said cause and are willing to make huge sacrifices for the good of something bigger than themselves.
These people are not working in sweatshops, they are not being paid with a cup of rice per day, and they are absolutely free to go elsewhere if they aren't happy with their career or made a mistake in taking this job. Let's be realistic when we talk about the working conditions these people are enduring.
n/a Harradar 2017-03-04
Look, some of us just want to plunder the Martian pyramids, okay?
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Fair, fair. Make sure you're harvesting the rare metal asteroids up there first, though.
n/a glmox 2017-03-04
pff, who cares about rare metals when you could be getting sick alien pharaoh loot like a fuckin insectoid crown or some shit
n/a going_for_a_wank 2017-03-04
pff, who cares about alien pharaoh loot when you can be banging alien babes
n/a DeterminismMorality 2017-03-04
Well unless you're a billionaire your shit out of luck.
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
Actually it's the other way around, you're describing the simplistic "homo economicus", that usually gets mocked as overly simplistic.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Oh yeah tell me more about how the billionaires are really so charitable and care about us so deeply.
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
They don't necessarily care about us so deeply. But they're human; being wealthy doesn't magically rob people of emotions like empathy, or anxiety about the future. Maybe it's all a vanity project, or maybe he's genuine and wants to make things better for humanity/reduce reliance on inefficient internal combustian engine, or maybe (shock horror) it's both. Either way, it's not necessarily a sign of maturity to assume anyone wealthy is a sociopath, even though many people (on reddit at least) insist otherwise.
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
What's 'bad' in your opinion? Lots of tech people are happy to work 60-80 hours a week for the likes of Bezos, Jobs, etc.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Someone posted a bunch of stuff in that thread.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/5xhkuk/why_does_this_sub_downvote_this_madness_when_its/deii4m5/
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
Those are the whiniest bullshit reasons to work for one of the most cutting edge companies in the US.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
Happy little wagecuck, you make porky proud
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
something something voluntary contracts
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
They're incredibly voluntary when the alternative to acquiring capital is to be homeless and unable to feed yourself
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
i can't tell whether you're laying it on super thick or are serious.. i need new emoji
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
both
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
well then fucka you!
But seriously anyone working for Elon Musk could go work for any major tech/engineering company and still make bank.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
where is this company where you can just sign up to work for without being exploited located?
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
/r/LateStageCapitalism is leaking....
sorry you're retarded.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
I'm pretty sure I'm banned from there
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
If you're banned from that sub, then what is your SSI disability?
n/a glmox 2017-03-04
capitalism is obviously inherently exploitative but there's still such a thing as actually liking your job, and anyone smart and qualified enough to get a job at spacex has the prospects and latitude to find such a job if they want to
n/a yetanothercfcgrunt 2017-03-04
The alternative is just going to work for a different company. Nobody who works at SpaceX or Tesla is there because it's their only option.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
is that Ben Shapiro, the author of this?
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
yeah, ben shapiro, mr. libertarian 'voluntary contract'
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Chapo had a bunch of hilarious book reading segments from him. What a goof.
n/a Thhueros 2017-03-04
In times like this its easy to forget, but these things remind us that the left does not have a monopoly on being fucking stupid.
n/a lol-da-mar-s-cool 2017-03-04
MANLETS, when will they learn?
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
Yeah, those workers should feel lucky for even being allowed to work for Musk!
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
exactly. spacex and tesla are two of the leading cutting edge companies in the us
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
Whoooooosh...
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
plz enlighten me /r/drama bro
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
You are on /r/drama too, you know. So you'd be an "/r/drama smartguy" too.
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
;)
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
honestly they're lucky they even get paid, working on Elon's vision is payment enough already
n/a MegaSeedsInYourBum 2017-03-04
Getting fucked over by your employer doesn't give you bragging rights, it gives you a sore ass.
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
show me where employees at spacex or tesla are 'getting fucked over'
n/a MegaSeedsInYourBum 2017-03-04
They're paid less than in other comparable jobs, have to work longer hours, the bosses set unrealistic goals and they have higher than average turnover (but they deny this).
If you can make more, work less, and not contribute to Red Faction IRL then you're getting fucked over working for Musk.
Also, remember this gem? https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/technology/2016/may/16/elon-musk-tesla-wages-apology
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
https://www.scribd.com/doc/286295234/SpaceX-Class-Action
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
tl;dr - are we talking about engineers or laborers?
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
Same thing.
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
they're not
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
Skilled labor = labor
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
not really
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
but they are
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
if you ever enter the white collar work force you'll know the difference. until then stfu with your labor theories.
source: washed dishes and cooked food before getting a degree and entering the white collar work force
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
they are though. You can't prove me wrong because they are. skilled labor = labor
n/a Works_of_memercy 2017-03-04
Wait wait wait, so Elon Musk only exploits stemlords? With actual blue collar laborers apparently being totes OK under him?
wtf I love musk now. /u/Prince_Kropotkin, what was our problem with him?
n/a eskachig 2017-03-04
Tesla wages are pretty shit, and stock options are no longer magnificent. I wouldn't work for them at this point, the return just isn't there.
n/a freet0 2017-03-04
Sounds like an average medical residency lol
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
except there's way better reasons for medical residents to have a huge workload and they're generally directly helping people too
n/a freet0 2017-03-04
Ah ok it's better to overwork the people doing work that affects others the most. Makes sense.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
Medical residents kill people if they fuck up, and they need to learn a lot of things quickly. I don't like people working 20 hour shifts, but if you're training to be a doctor then I don't see the problem with a few years of your life being very focused on work.
n/a AtomicWolf425 2017-03-04
So being overworked doesn't make it more likely that you'll fuck up and kill someone, got it
n/a fadlpadl 2017-03-04
Actually the medical workload is the invention of an actual coke addicted workaholic. Like, the current idea of how long medical personnel needs to work is based on the steady consumption of stimulants (Most notably cocaine).
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
I think we were talking about two different things. Work hours per day vs steady work over months or years.
n/a fadlpadl 2017-03-04
The point remains, doctors are overworked not for "Good reasons" but out of tradition and lack of doctors.
And either way doctors work too much.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
I think that a heavy workload (i.e being busy, not to the point of physical exhaustion any one day, but having to work most days for an extended period of time) is a good thing for doctors in training so they can learn best practices ASAP.
n/a fadlpadl 2017-03-04
The point of physical exhausting is damn well reached most days.
Medical residents work up to 130 hours a week (Although most "Just" get between 80-100 hours a week), and a good portion of that is just paperwork. How much of a better doctor do you think someone is going to be after 12 straight hours of paperwork?
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
n/a fadlpadl 2017-03-04
The point here is that doctors are crippling their health and their ability to improve, to live up to the energy levels of a coke fiend workaholic, in order to dedicate about 40% of their time to paperwork and similar.
That's not a good reason, and they're not really helping anyone.
I absolutely agree that new doctors need to work a lot, it's part of the reason why many schools start them off working at the hospital from year 1 of medical school.
n/a tomato-123 2017-03-04
I mean they can just not work there if it's so bad. Wageslave blah blah blah but it not like your average spacex employee would be struggling to put food on the table or find another good job. Why do you hate voluntary transactions so much.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
It's definitely true that we aren't talking about people who have few other options and are living paycheck to paycheck, which makes the libertarian "but it's voluntary!!!" bullshit a little less stupid. However bad working conditions are not something I want to see at any wage level. Exploitation at higher wages is still, you know, exploitation. Am I gonna spend my time fighting that as opposed to throwing my lot in with the Fight for 15 people? Probably not.
n/a dood98998 2017-03-04
Eh, people chose that job. They knew how bad it would be, but something was worth it for them. If it really wasn't worth it. they wouldn't have the best minds, no?
n/a purgepurgepurgepurg3 2017-03-04
Lol yeah and someone chose to treat their employees like shit, are you too retarded to see they aren't mutually exclusive?
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
https://i.imgur.com/x753waX.png
n/a CirqueDuFuder 2017-03-04
Can you teach me your memes? What the fuck is this?
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
I was watching this and thought it might be a new Porky.
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
And where do you suggest they go that is a "good job"? We're assuming that the reason SpaceX is a "bad job" is because of the extremely high work hours and lack of fair compensation for extra hours back. It's like that everywhere these days, you know. Direct result of capitalism.
n/a tomato-123 2017-03-04
People who are qualified to work at spacex have extremely good outside options. People with good options have good choices, they chose to work at a prestigious exciting job with high pay in exchange for long hours, and they could give up some of those things in exchange lower hours. It's like a big law attorney; they can work 80 hours per week, make partner and make millions, or they can be the in house lawyer for some company, be easily upper middle class, and work 40 hours per week.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
And all of these companies have in common that their employees get exploited
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
Stop saying exploit like working for Musk is a 19th century stockyard and the only other option is being a farm hand
n/a FancyLaserEyes 2017-03-04
I don't know. The first one about the lawsuit seems a bit silly. I don't doubt the guy was overworked, but to use that as an example of why Musk is a bad guy is a little ridiculous. Musk is probably not the guy's direct boss, and probably doesn't even know him. It's entirely possible this guy had a manager that was being unreasonable. I wouldn't be surprised if Musk didn't know anyone at that facility. Also, "case still pending"? I guess the Internet has already reached their judgement, eh?
Lots of people have shitty bosses. Hell, my boss is a fucking jackass. He's not a bad person--just a shitty manager.
n/a CirqueDuFuder 2017-03-04
SRD literally aligns with AngryDM's favorite hobby.
n/a ICallWooWooOnU 2017-03-04
You're just jealous, because you hate people who actually made something of themselves, it proves to you that you didn't fail because of external circumstance, you failed because you're a weak person /u/Prince_Kropotkin and you deserved to fail
n/a subpoutine 2017-03-04
And yet they'll still unironically jerk themselves dry over how Reddit supposedly turned on Jennifer Lawrence because her nude pics leaked.
n/a Works_of_memercy 2017-03-04
Obviously, it's also cool to like famous people that reddit hates.
n/a therealdirtydan 2017-03-04
Love the comment that's like "all he's done is provide huge budgets and overwork employees" and I'm like.....yeah that's definitely small potatoes with the budget.
Dude tried to slip that actually major accomplishment past everyone. Sly dog
n/a ____________13 2017-03-04
I hate him because his name reminds me I need a shower.
n/a CucksLoveTrump 2017-03-04
I hate him because he looks dumb
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
And he's white
n/a subpoutine 2017-03-04
Same thing.
n/a tomato-123 2017-03-04
They just hate Penn graduates. Trump, Musk, Ivanka, etc. Bet those haters went to Cornell smh.
n/a boozehelps 2017-03-04
Or worse, Brown.
n/a YourGayOpinion 2017-03-04
28 credits and no grades. Its like a fucking daycare.
n/a The_Reason_Trump_Won 2017-03-04
Wahhhhhhhhh he """"""overworks""""" his employees like almost every other fucking notable/big employer in America wahhhhhhhh
n/a tomato-123 2017-03-04
Lol seriously. And also these employees that SRD is so eager to defend now are the same white techbros they'd be hating on in any other situation.
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
Irrational hatred for musk aside, what kind of funny logic is this? If everyone else is doing it that makes it ok?
I know it's a pretty American thing to slavishly slobber all over the cocks of people way richer than you, but come on 🤔
n/a HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-03-04
What is "overworked" in this context?
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
working the same hours as the CEO.
I mean it might be one thing if Musk was fucking off to play golf, but when all of the top management has to work 100 hours a week with no weekends off. It doesn't seem as bad to me.
n/a botacct22 2017-03-04
This is how Japan happened
n/a CirqueDuFuder 2017-03-04
Actually volcanoes I think is the correct answer.
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
I'm guessing the shit his companies have been accused of, like overtime without pay and being obligated to work weekends for no extra compensation etc
n/a HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-03-04
You mean salaried workers sometimes work more than 40 hours a week?
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
Without pay, yes.
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
OHHH NOEEESSS
n/a HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-03-04
lol well they are salaried so...
n/a jlong1202 2017-03-04
Do you know what salaried means?
n/a YourGayOpinion 2017-03-04
Americans like to work hard and then fuck your mom hard.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
Americans are eternally classcucked, don't even try to reason with them
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
It's pretty amusing but also kinda sad.
n/a meatduck12 2017-03-04
Don't worry, I'm on your side
n/a DistortedLines 2017-03-04
As opposed to which glorious communist class-less state-less paradise?
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
It's already enough to live anywhere else other than Germany or Japan. No need for communism
n/a DistortedLines 2017-03-04
Thats not what Im saying, goy. There has never, and will never* be a society without classes where everyone is treated equally or whatever the fuck. You can have places where people have different attitudes towards being classcucked, but the end result is generally the same.
*unless you're in a utopic, post-scarcity society.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
sniff my farts
n/a DistortedLines 2017-03-04
say that to my face, and not online, and we'll see what happens.
n/a going_for_a_wank 2017-03-04
tbh you would probably end up sniffing his farts
n/a DistortedLines 2017-03-04
True tbh
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-03-04
SRDines can never resist jerking over shit like this. Also, the sub has been flooded with all sorts of strange creatures from across the site.
n/a The_Reason_Trump_Won 2017-03-04
These are highly qualified and educated professionals. If they didn't wanna slavishly slobber all over Musk's cock and work so much, they could easily make a killing elsewhere. They're free to leave.
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
I'm actually referring to your attitude, the bizarre "waaaaaah bad working conditions aren't a big deal, everyone does it" justification, lul
Whether they can go elsewhere is irrelevant
n/a Ace4929 2017-03-04
Yea but when you say bad working conditions its not like theyre getting their hands chopped off by a spinning jenny or bringing their kids to work so they can crawl inside the machines to clean them out, yea working extra hours sucks but its not like its some crime against humanity
n/a The_Reason_Trump_Won 2017-03-04
And I'm saying they're not that bad if people who could make way more money for working way less hours like to stay there.
n/a takesteady12 2017-03-04
Also, why are they shitting on him for being Anti-Union? It's not like that's a unique position for major corporations.
n/a Chavril 2017-03-04
The fact that Musk and his employees would rather work for their bread than wait in a line for it makes /u/0x800703E6 pretty salty.
n/a newcomer_ts 2017-03-04
I don't get it?
What's his point?
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
People like him, so he's bad, I guese
n/a ChateauJack 2017-03-04
Can we finally admit that SRD is, in fact, SRSbis now ?
n/a HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-03-04
It's actually SRDbisque
n/a OiBoiFloyd 2017-03-04
I guess I dont really like Elon Musk but theres nothing that really sets him apart from other asshole billionaires. I dont get why theres a special hateboner for him.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
It's the hypocrisy between exploiting the labor of thousands of employees and shady shit in general when it comes to securing their capital while simultaneously presenting yourself as some weird freedom fighter for humanity. The smugness and arrogance just gets to my head
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
i mean is there though?
Bill Gates was basically the Stalin of the tech world in the 80s and 90s. But by having no compeition it really helped all of us in the end. Plus he then used his money to help out people in the 3rd world.
So did he destroy the lives of a lot of people in the US? of course, but in the end it was good for everyone
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
Stalin killed 30 million, Bill Gates saved 30 million
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
before he did that he destroyed a lot of other people with bullshit business tactics.
plus without Stalin helping modernize russia the nazis would have destroyed them when they invaded
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
Yeah, I get that. Just a bit hyperbolic
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
The only people he 'destroyed' were wealthy silicon valley types, by being a better businessman and frankly just having a better product than things like PS/2 which were available at the time. Boo fucking hoo.
n/a darth_stroyer 2017-03-04
holodomor is a lie
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
classcucked af
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
lol, a guy fucks over the lives of hundreds of 1%'s and helps out the 99%. and we have to hate this guy apprently?
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
you being able to shitpost on your Windows system surely was a great benefit to humanity
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
the global 99%, so basically all those starving people in 3rd world countries.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
Nice charity work, but let's not forget where all that money comes from. He didn't create it out of nothingness, he was and still is one of the most ruthless business man around, and in the process directly contributed to much off the suffering everywhere, in the developed world and in the underdeveloped world. This is what I mean about hypocrisy: The dude has a net worth close to 100 billion dollars and still accumulates wealth at a rapid pace, but because he gives a couple billion each year of that to projects like spreading GMO crop in Ghana or eradicating diseases, he's suddenly the good guy? You can't buy your way into heaven
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
He had $100 billion, he's given away 40 and made 20.
n/a notrunning4president 2017-03-04
again. the global 1% might hate him but do you really think anyone that isn't in that group gives a shit? do you think the people in Ghana that can't even prounounce his name much less know anything about him besides the fact that hes white cares about what the guy that is saving their lives did in the past?
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
For example?
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Microsoft
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
Most of these seem trivial compared to the work of the Gates Foundation, and the overall value (jobs, productivity, taxable income etc..) created by Microsoft.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
see stickied post
n/a Tetizeraz 2017-03-04
?
While he still was a chairman during the Ballmer years, Microsoft under Satya Nadella is very different.
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-03-04
In all fairness, SRD is chock full of said smug arrogance but so is most of the internet.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
they're liberals after all
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-03-04
True but even moderates like myself are guilty of the same sin. Kinda just traits that seem to taint all parts of the spectrum.
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
I meant liberal in the "lives under and is in endorsement of capitalist culture which breeds a sense of smugness and toxic political culture as part of its ideology". Everyone is guilty of it though, it's hard to completely remove yourself from ideology
n/a atakeonhooper 2017-03-04
how do you know someone is a moderate?
just wait, they'll masturbate into their own hand and then drink the cum
n/a Malevolent_USB_Drive 2017-03-04
having strong opinions is for losers!
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-03-04
Well I am bisexual but I prefer the jizz of others over my own. Mine's a little tart for my tastes. Also, I try not to be so messy when jacking off. Cleaning up messes is never fun.
n/a darth_stroyer 2017-03-04
Fuck that's moderate as hell
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-03-04
You haven't even seen my most moderate form! Mwuahahahahahaha!
n/a [deleted] 2017-03-04
[removed]
n/a crudehumourisdivine 2017-03-04
i think at least part of it that he's idolized by the kind of people they hate, like the STEM Techbro Brogrammers keeping women out of tech
n/a -jean-paul- 2017-03-04
I happen to like Musk but I wouldn't be surprised if his borderline messianic overpromising white people nonsense rubs some people the wrong way.
Sometimes even I find it irritating, other times I admire it because people with major ambition are a rare breed.
n/a Ylajali_2002 2017-03-04
Yeah, I find the whole the whole techno-visionary posture foolish and worthy of derision, and it's not a good thing the be exploiting workers, but leftist moralism does nothing to solve those problems. The issue isn't that corporations are willing to take advantage of loose market regulations -- they should be willing if they're to remain profitable -- the issue is that markets are mostly unregulated in the first place. You can try to shame CEOs and corporations into self-regulating all you want, but it's not going to happen, because the moment a corporation starts self-regulating it ceases to have an advantage over its competitors, starts loosing profits, and is quickly replaced by another corporation willing to take advantage.
It really shows the political naivety of a lot of these people that they think they can take the shaming tactics they've developed in the culture wars and apply them just as well to genuine political problems.
n/a Ennui2778 2017-03-04
There we go.
n/a holditsteady 2017-03-04
musk has far too much money that i want and should be put to death alongside his rich business buddies
n/a ieatpussy69 2017-03-04
tbui
n/a Wacnews_the_White 2017-03-04
REEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! That's just our own home team stirring up the pot in there. I see you /u/Malevolent_USB_Drive and /u/HodorThe Door Holder.
n/a -jean-paul- 2017-03-04
/u/HodorTheDoorHolder is the clear winner here. But in /u/Malevolent_USB_Drive's defense, being a communist in 2017 is so blatantly retarded that getting the upper hand on a 2017 communist is really no victory at all.
n/a BasicallyADoctor 2017-03-04
Every one of the comments by /u/malevolent_usb_drive were awful, just terrible. The worst! Please, I can't handle them they were so bad. Auuugh! That is me crying in pain for reading the comments 😷😷 ⬅ me sick from the disease you gave me with your abhorrent comments 🚮
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
doctor please cure me of the cancer your comment gave me
n/a going_for_a_wank 2017-03-04
T H I S
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
can you sticky this /u/Prince_Kropotkin
http://i.imgur.com/3uZfO9Q.jpg
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
can you sticky this /u/riemann1413
http://i.imgur.com/3uZfO9Q.jpg (NSFW)
n/a freet0 2017-03-04
is SRD taking queues from angrydm now? lul
n/a riemann1413 2017-03-04
y'all
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
wow you actually posted a solid meme for once
n/a riemann1413 2017-03-04
kill
n/a pigeondoubletake 2017-03-04
dead babies
n/a blertyuh 2017-03-04
lmao never mind someone else passed it to you
n/a riemann1413 2017-03-04
yourself
n/a dj_ilo 2017-03-04
nice, you did it, I'm proud of you
n/a ComedicSans 2017-03-04
lol
n/a riemann1413 2017-03-04
no, u
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
n/a uniqueguy263 2017-03-04
He's a jackass to his workers, don't get me wrong. He's just doing some good things, and the reasons they didn't like him were dumb
n/a riemann1413 2017-03-04
lmao double replying
u sure don't care
reevaluate your life
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
I'm seeing a lot of people talking this "exploiting workers" meme, but nobody has cited any sources, starting to suspect it might be a malicious rumour or exaggeration.
n/a Prince_Kropotkin 2017-03-04
There's been a ton of links in both threads.
n/a HivemindBuster 2017-03-04
None worthwhile in this thread at least, I don't have the will to slog through more sanctimonious whining on SRD.
n/a charlesgrodinfan 2017-03-04
ITT: hourly wage /r/socialism kids insisting every white collar employee should rise up against their wage cucking employers
n/a point_shaver 2017-03-04
To me, companies treating their employees like shit is usually a good indicator that they're willing to fuck over society at large as well, provided the right incentive, opportunity and cover story. Govts. you can change (allegedly), companies usually last. Especially when they have the govt. in their pocket as well. In itself, its not a big deal or something people should freak out about.
n/a 80BAIT08 2017-03-04
Commies can't see past "rich man" so want to destroy everything about it. Doesn't matter if it's advancing technology to them. What cave people.
n/a CH0AM_N0MSKY 2017-03-04
Go jerk off to your deluded space boy somewhere else.