One author and former diversity advocate described why she no longer takes part: “I have never seen social interaction this fucked up,” she wrote in an email. “And I’ve been in prison.”
She also scrapped a work in progress that featured a POC character, citing a sense shared by many publishing insiders that to write outside one’s own identity as a white author simply isn’t worth the inevitable backlash.
I read it, it's a good article and points out a lot of issues. The thing is, I just can't bring myself to care about a bunch of teenagers yelling on Twitter about problematic books about fairies and werewolves and shit.
lol reading this article and seeing all the shitty fantasy YA book titles made me lol nostalgically:
A Court of Wings and Ruins: lemme guess: Mary Sue, stubborn red head MC, teenage style political "drama", a shitty magic system and of course, a dark and mysterious rival prince love interest or whatever. Maybe it'll be a hot thief orphan for a "twist".
Jesus, how do writers of books like these get the motivation to actually type out hundreds of pages for shit like this.
Close, but it's post Susan Collins, assume Katniss Everdeen until otherwise demonstrated. Apparently the main character is a hunter girl who then gets kidnapped and then suffers Stockholm Syndrome. And it's got faeries.
Interesting article. This is worrisome to me because while i guess at its very core its well intentioned, it so freaking badly thought, to such a clusterfuck level that it ends up hurting progressives and their narratives. Even worse it ends up being associated with Dems as a political party and ends up hurting Dems.
Also another reason why you never give into SJWs is that they always seek further control. You apologize once and say you were wrong or offensive (even if you weren't) and you will end up apologizing every time.
it so freaking badly thought, to such a clusterfuck level that it ends up hurting progressives and their narratives. Even worse it ends up being associated with Dems as a political party and ends up hurting Dems.
For me this was a super relieving article because it seems like people for the most part aren't actually stupid and are pretty capable of seeing and ignoring this bullshit for what it is. The publishers showed little reaction, the sales were still good and the actual audience was fed up with this invasion of their hobby by whiny fucks.
The Young Adult book scene these days is filled with a bunch of phonies.
One of the biggest reasons I left YA was because I was surrounded by phonies. That's all. They were coming in the goddam window. For instance, they had this twitter account, @b00kstorebabe, that was the phoniest bastard I ever met in my life. Ten times worse than old Thurmer. On Sundays, for instance, old @b00kstorebabe went around sending tweets with everybody's parents when they got on their Twitter accounts. She'd be charming as hell and all... I can't stand that stuff. It drives me crazy. It makes me so depressed I go crazy. I hated that goddam YA scene.
Yeah, I would like to read that book just out of spite now. On the other hand: who gives a shit what some fake PoC accounts with pictures from google images and purple - haired mayo twats from twitter think - they don't read these books anyway.
" Muh, wrongthink books" - what's next, bonfire of the vanities?
(Even The Black Witch, which took one of the worst online beatings in recent memory, scored a No. 1 rating in Amazon’s department of “Teen & Young Adult Wizards Fantasy” a few days after its release and has been overwhelmingly well-reviewed since.)
Among the book-buying public, though, that parade may be mostly passing unnoticed. The scandals that loom so large on Twitter don’t necessarily interest consumers; instead, the tempest of these controversies remains confined to a handful of internet teapots where a few angry voices can seem thunderously loud.
As for the potential of these campaigns to affect a book’s sales, that same publisher is unconcerned....The scandals that loom so large on Twitter don’t necessarily interest consumers; instead, the tempest of these controversies remains confined to a handful of internet teapots where a few angry voices can seem thunderously loud.
At least the YA publishers did their market research. Unlike bigger companies like Sony and MTV.
I think people are just seeing that the vast amounts of money that can be made off disgustingly terrible young adult fiction threatens to irreversibly defile one of the last truly great things humanity has to offer the universe, literature.
There really are far reaching consequences for growing prevalence of shitty young adult literature and I'm afraid we've already crossed the point of no return.
I hope people are seeing that the vast amounts of money that can be made off disgustingly terrible young adult fiction threatens to irreversibly defile one of the last truly great things humanity has to offer the universe, literature.
There really are far reaching consequences for growing prevalence of shitty young adult literature and I'm afraid we've already crossed the point of no return and the idiots leading the charge are dismissing just how fucking disastrously terrible this growing trend is because they only see it for another place to virtue signal.
I get what you're saying, but at the same time it's not like Stephanie Meyer was going to write the next Ulysses before she decided to cash in on teenage vampires.
I spend so much time arguing in favor of social justice that I don’t want to disagree with someone arguing in favor of the eradication of injustice, because I don’t want to give alt-right people any ammunition, even if I… disagree with the person on “my side”.
I mean, the author touches upon the problems of people reading a book and taking things out of context and blowing up a problem, but...they don't really show both sides of the problem with non-white authors. They also don't show how queer or non-white authors are getting utterly slammed out there on social media for not being queer/(race) enough. As if that's their only value.
Do you think that last thing is white people's fault too, /u/Dravvie?
I mean, in a sense I agree, white feminist women are the worst.
Something about the way you phrased this reads like bait.
But no, as far as queer people go, it's not just white women or whatever. People are just self interested in seeing their personal narrative represented.
A lot of people look at artists and writers who are NB/queer/certain races and get really upset if their work doesn't represent the narrative that they feel that the person's "cultural check box" should. It's really fucked up, and far more fucked up than straight white people feeling left out. (I say this as a mostly white person. Though, that's another basket of issues I don't want to touch.)
They're basically hearing that anything they create with valid experiences and thoughts aren't valid enough for their own communities and often get pressured to create within community conformity or GTFO.
I mean, you seemed to say that the main problem with rabid purity-testing SJWs is that they are purity-testing other people besides white cishets, and that in itself was critiquing the article that condemned purity-testing for not condemning it politically correctly enough.
No, my problem with it was that everyone in publishing gets shit on.
Straight white dude? Sorry, people think you're now only allowed to write about that, and you might even get the cold shoulder from other straight white dudes for going outside the box.
The whole point was that the author was hiding behind oh man, these people are crying racism about one person but...it's not really exclusive so it kinda read like they were making excuses. Especially considering they had some drama in 2014, lol.
No, my problem with it was that everyone in publishing gets shit on.
Yeah, so you criticize the article that says that maybe people shouldn't be shat on for being perceived as not-inclusive-enough for what you perceive as not being inclusive enough.
> ...This kind of behaviour basically means that the conversation is reduced to name calling which means that the kind of literary discussions that would actually improve our media doesn't get to happen.
/u/wooster84 you guys would have a considerably better shot at improving your media if you'd just guillotine all those talentless amateurs tbh
These guys are basically the religious right though. Turned out all they needed was a thin veneer of feminism and "liberal" institutions would enthusiastically advocate all the cultural repression their hearts desired. The Jack Thompsons and Pat Robertsons of the world must be kicking themselves for not figuring out this scam sooner.
Fat white girls insulting other fat white girls using slang invented by gay black men ("dragged," "you don't have the range"). I don't have the strength for this nonsense.
The Young Adult book scene these days is filled with a bunch of phonies.
One of the biggest reasons I left YA was because I was surrounded by phonies. That's all. They were coming in the goddam window. For instance, they had this twitter account, @b00kstorebabe, that was the phoniest bastard I ever met in my life. Ten times worse than old Thurmer. On Sundays, for instance, old @b00kstorebabe went around sending tweets with everybody's parents when they got on their Twitter accounts. She'd be charming as hell and all... I can't stand that stuff. It drives me crazy. It makes me so depressed I go crazy. I hated that goddam YA scene.
77 comments
1 SnapshillBot 2017-08-07
This, but unironically.
Snapshots:
I am a bot. (Info / Contact)
1 Matues49 2017-08-07
Kek
1 squarefaces 2017-08-07
Well we also know they've never been here either.
1 SmurfPrivilege 2017-08-07
Damned if you do, damned if you don't
1 Justhereforsatan 2017-08-07
Well when you have a beef in prison, you don't solve it through social interaction, you just beat and sodomize the person you disagree with.
1 trj820 2017-08-07
But that is still a social interaction. It's just less degenerate than holding an impromptu Two Minutes Hate on Twitter.
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
This is a pretty interesting read, y'all. I highly suggest you guys read it when you're done with your shitty agenda/bird posts.
1 UTAutism 2017-08-07
Bird posts are the future bud.
1 Kazimir-Malevich 2017-08-07
>shitty
>bird posts
Choose one
1 YHofSuburbia 2017-08-07
I read it, it's a good article and points out a lot of issues. The thing is, I just can't bring myself to care about a bunch of teenagers yelling on Twitter about problematic books about fairies and werewolves and shit.
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
Delete your account.
1 YHofSuburbia 2017-08-07
That was pretty rude. Please apologize.
1 menvaren 2017-08-07
Unfortunately, this is becoming the fuel that runs America.
1 heavenlytoaster 2017-08-07
You just made realize that if it ends my retirement accounts might drop.
Wtf I love outrage culture now.
1 John_Kvetch 2017-08-07
lol reading this article and seeing all the shitty fantasy YA book titles made me lol nostalgically:
A Court of Wings and Ruins: lemme guess: Mary Sue, stubborn red head MC, teenage style political "drama", a shitty magic system and of course, a dark and mysterious rival prince love interest or whatever. Maybe it'll be a hot thief orphan for a "twist".
Jesus, how do writers of books like these get the motivation to actually type out hundreds of pages for shit like this.
1 OhNoHesZooming 2017-08-07
Close, but it's post Susan Collins, assume Katniss Everdeen until otherwise demonstrated. Apparently the main character is a hunter girl who then gets kidnapped and then suffers Stockholm Syndrome. And it's got faeries.
1 PlvGdm 2017-08-07
10 bucks says there's further drama in the article author's Twitter feed
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
Oh absolutely. Side note, she is hot af.
1 MakeAmericaSageAgain 2017-08-07
You have a fetish for the plain Jane type?
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
ye
1 MakeAmericaSageAgain 2017-08-07
That's cool. Like an anti-kink.
1 EarnestNoMeta 2017-08-07
Vanilla is a classic
1 HivemindBuster 2017-08-07
I'm literally shaking right now.
1 TehGroff 2017-08-07
Asking the hard questions.
1 Teresa_May 2017-08-07
fucking lol
1 JohnBlind 2017-08-07
That bitch's twitter bio is unbelievable
> Writer, author of SARA, published in Believe Me Not: An Unreliable Anthology.
Writing """short stories""" in glorified puzzlebooks for children make you a writer the same way jotting down a grocerie list makes you one
I can find like nine reviews, three of which are by one of the ""writers"" and all of nine of them use the word 'diverse' to describe the drivel
> singer, pianist
Being an amateur singer-songwriter doesn't make you a pianist
> mother, gardener, Mormon, and more.
...
Imagine this much of a cretin goddamn
1 crefakis 2017-08-07
Is it racism when they're fantasy races?
I hate wookies, fucking rugfuckers.
1 mcje 2017-08-07
Fantasy racism
1 EarnestNoMeta 2017-08-07
Goddamn crab people
1 bareballzthebitch 2017-08-07
TIL people still read books.
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
yeah nerds lmao
1 hbnsckl 2017-08-07
Some light supplementary twitter drama.
https://twitter.com/katrosenfield/status/894545861040013314
1 grafton29 2017-08-07
Interesting article. This is worrisome to me because while i guess at its very core its well intentioned, it so freaking badly thought, to such a clusterfuck level that it ends up hurting progressives and their narratives. Even worse it ends up being associated with Dems as a political party and ends up hurting Dems.
Also another reason why you never give into SJWs is that they always seek further control. You apologize once and say you were wrong or offensive (even if you weren't) and you will end up apologizing every time.
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
hwhat
1 grafton29 2017-08-07
It makes a lot of sense, LAMECHUNS. Ok.
1 snappleteadrink 2017-08-07
For me this was a super relieving article because it seems like people for the most part aren't actually stupid and are pretty capable of seeing and ignoring this bullshit for what it is. The publishers showed little reaction, the sales were still good and the actual audience was fed up with this invasion of their hobby by whiny fucks.
1 snallygaster 2017-08-07
Yeah, for once a media industry is handling whiny teens the right way. The less you engage with them, the better.
1 moudougou 2017-08-07
Yeah, the real world impact is limited, that's the most important part.
1 nomad1c 2017-08-07
that's why trump can basically say anything, because he doesn't apologise. you can't shame a man with no shame
1 Zeuter 2017-08-07
tl;dr
¯(º_°)/¯
1 BigDaddy_Delta 2017-08-07
Fuck those people
1 squarefaces 2017-08-07
not just describing racism, describing it as a trait of the "bad guys"
apparently showing racism as something that's wrong and needs to be stopped is "problematic"
1 HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-08-07
The Young Adult book scene these days is filled with a bunch of phonies.
One of the biggest reasons I left YA was because I was surrounded by phonies. That's all. They were coming in the goddam window. For instance, they had this twitter account, @b00kstorebabe, that was the phoniest bastard I ever met in my life. Ten times worse than old Thurmer. On Sundays, for instance, old @b00kstorebabe went around sending tweets with everybody's parents when they got on their Twitter accounts. She'd be charming as hell and all... I can't stand that stuff. It drives me crazy. It makes me so depressed I go crazy. I hated that goddam YA scene.
1 trj820 2017-08-07
Username... almost checks out?
1 HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-08-07
Hodor Caufield
1 mehforeverybody 2017-08-07
Yeah, I would like to read that book just out of spite now. On the other hand: who gives a shit what some fake PoC accounts with pictures from google images and purple - haired mayo twats from twitter think - they don't read these books anyway.
" Muh, wrongthink books" - what's next, bonfire of the vanities?
1 bareballzthebitch 2017-08-07
I read 'Huckleberry Finn' in school. I don't think they do now.
1 mehforeverybody 2017-08-07
They banned it, because of the N word....I would link the article, but I refuse to link to Marysue.
1 darth_tiffany 2017-08-07
Maybe in whatever hicksville Jesus nowhere trailer park you grew up in, in civilized country kids are still reading it.
1 mehforeverybody 2017-08-07
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/05/kill-mockingbird-huckleberry-finn-banned-schools-virginia-racism/
Before this
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2011/01/07/books/07huck.html?pagewanted=all&referer=
1 darth_tiffany 2017-08-07
Question, answered.
1 GARBAGE_MACHINE 2017-08-07
Your articles refer to Virginia and Alabama.
kys
1 WalterMatthau 2017-08-07
Lol even your own links prove you wrong.
1 Michelanvalo 2017-08-07
Basically, twitter outrage doesn't matter at all.
1 Dravvie 2017-08-07
Actually, I didn't say it in the other thread but I was one of the people who gave it a 5. The book was good.
The people having a shit fit were out of line but they made me buy a book.
1 SmurfPrivilege 2017-08-07
At least the YA publishers did their market research. Unlike bigger companies like Sony and MTV.
1 neutralvoter 2017-08-07
I think people are just seeing that the vast amounts of money that can be made off disgustingly terrible young adult fiction threatens to irreversibly defile one of the last truly great things humanity has to offer the universe, literature.
There really are far reaching consequences for growing prevalence of shitty young adult literature and I'm afraid we've already crossed the point of no return.
1 aggressiveshitpost 2017-08-07
1 neutralvoter 2017-08-07
I hope people are seeing that the vast amounts of money that can be made off disgustingly terrible young adult fiction threatens to irreversibly defile one of the last truly great things humanity has to offer the universe, literature.
There really are far reaching consequences for growing prevalence of shitty young adult literature and I'm afraid we've already crossed the point of no return and the idiots leading the charge are dismissing just how fucking disastrously terrible this growing trend is because they only see it for another place to virtue signal.
1 SethRichOrDieTryin 2017-08-07
I get what you're saying, but at the same time it's not like Stephanie Meyer was going to write the next Ulysses before she decided to cash in on teenage vampires.
1 MelungeonQueen 2017-08-07
Only idiots fuck with books
1 The_Reason_Trump_Won 2017-08-07
1 aggressiveshitpost 2017-08-07
GAS THE SELKIES RACE WAR NOW
1 Ylajali_2002 2017-08-07
wow who would have thought that adults who spend their lives blogging about children's books are mentally unstable
1 mcje 2017-08-07
It's all about ethics in children journalism
1 bobbybonnadouchey 2017-08-07
Shit /u/zachums if I knew this was sticky worthy I would have posted it myself.
Here's some yummy lack of self awareness from the gamerghazi and [YAWriters].(https://www.reddit.com/r/YAwriters/comments/6s65v6/the_toxic_drama_on_ya_twitter/)
1 Zachums 2017-08-07
It's fantastic drama, it just seems like most people on this board these days think a post about another sub's reaction to something is a good post.
1 Ace4929 2017-08-07
Damn, you know its bad when you lose Ghazi on a social justice witch hunt
1 no_frills 2017-08-07
1 Works_of_memercy 2017-08-07
Do you think that last thing is white people's fault too, /u/Dravvie?
I mean, in a sense I agree, white feminist women are the worst.
1 Dravvie 2017-08-07
Something about the way you phrased this reads like bait.
But no, as far as queer people go, it's not just white women or whatever. People are just self interested in seeing their personal narrative represented.
A lot of people look at artists and writers who are NB/queer/certain races and get really upset if their work doesn't represent the narrative that they feel that the person's "cultural check box" should. It's really fucked up, and far more fucked up than straight white people feeling left out. (I say this as a mostly white person. Though, that's another basket of issues I don't want to touch.)
They're basically hearing that anything they create with valid experiences and thoughts aren't valid enough for their own communities and often get pressured to create within community conformity or GTFO.
1 Works_of_memercy 2017-08-07
I mean, you seemed to say that the main problem with rabid purity-testing SJWs is that they are purity-testing other people besides white cishets, and that in itself was critiquing the article that condemned purity-testing for not condemning it politically correctly enough.
1 Dravvie 2017-08-07
No, my problem with it was that everyone in publishing gets shit on.
Straight white dude? Sorry, people think you're now only allowed to write about that, and you might even get the cold shoulder from other straight white dudes for going outside the box.
The whole point was that the author was hiding behind oh man, these people are crying racism about one person but...it's not really exclusive so it kinda read like they were making excuses. Especially considering they had some drama in 2014, lol.
1 Works_of_memercy 2017-08-07
Yeah, so you criticize the article that says that maybe people shouldn't be shat on for being perceived as not-inclusive-enough for what you perceive as not being inclusive enough.
1 Dravvie 2017-08-07
K.
1 DarkTemplar26 2017-08-07
Oh /u/Meshleth is going nuts again? Better check this out
1 bobbybonnadouchey 2017-08-07
Xir is about to stab a (white) bitch.
1 JohnBlind 2017-08-07
> ...This kind of behaviour basically means that the conversation is reduced to name calling which means that the kind of literary discussions that would actually improve our media doesn't get to happen.
/u/wooster84 you guys would have a considerably better shot at improving your media if you'd just guillotine all those talentless amateurs tbh
1 godofdae 2017-08-07
Fujoshi ruin everything.
1 yourshittytherapist 2017-08-07
I though fujoshi hated women?
1 glmox 2017-08-07
i miss when it was the religious right leading "campaigns to keep offensive books off shelves"
like sure occasionally there's kick-up at some hick library over harry potter or something but they've really lost their mojo
1 Chicup 2017-08-07
Meet the new boss.
1 LedinToke 2017-08-07
They need to take the austin powers approach to get their mojo back. They were at least really fun to interact with
1 birdboy2000 2017-08-07
These guys are basically the religious right though. Turned out all they needed was a thin veneer of feminism and "liberal" institutions would enthusiastically advocate all the cultural repression their hearts desired. The Jack Thompsons and Pat Robertsons of the world must be kicking themselves for not figuring out this scam sooner.
1 moudougou 2017-08-07
https://twitter.com/SMCarterWrites/status/894620237706014721
lmao
1 DannyLee90 2017-08-07
That profile picture says everything, really.
1 EarnestNoMeta 2017-08-07
Crazy cat lady.
1 HivemindBuster 2017-08-07
This is the first time I've heard of YA twitter but everyone involved seems terrible.
1 blockcheyn 2017-08-07
When I hear the word YA, I reach for my gun
1 darth_tiffany 2017-08-07
Fat white girls insulting other fat white girls using slang invented by gay black men ("dragged," "you don't have the range"). I don't have the strength for this nonsense.
1 heavenlytoaster 2017-08-07
Will this finally trigger the cultural civil war?
1 Nicholai_Dimitri 2017-08-07
Imagine unironically caring this much about a fucking kids book
1 takaci 2017-08-07
Well, isn't the book about racism? Are we not even allowed to write racist interactions anymore?
1 savantfool 2017-08-07
They are calling a book racist that openly is against racism and tells about someone leaving such shit behind and evolving past racism
1 HodorTheDoorHolder 2017-08-07
The Young Adult book scene these days is filled with a bunch of phonies.
One of the biggest reasons I left YA was because I was surrounded by phonies. That's all. They were coming in the goddam window. For instance, they had this twitter account, @b00kstorebabe, that was the phoniest bastard I ever met in my life. Ten times worse than old Thurmer. On Sundays, for instance, old @b00kstorebabe went around sending tweets with everybody's parents when they got on their Twitter accounts. She'd be charming as hell and all... I can't stand that stuff. It drives me crazy. It makes me so depressed I go crazy. I hated that goddam YA scene.