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1. This Post - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, removeddit.com, archive.is

2. suffered flash crashes on some trad... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

3. https://twitter.com/biop3rl/status/... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

4. https://twitter.com/Maksim61095204/... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

5. https://twitter.com/Markusyt93/stat... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

6. https://twitter.com/bhaspro/status/... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

7. https://twitter.com/_marketflash_/s... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

8. https://twitter.com/MichailOk/statu... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

9. https://twitter.com/wallstreetduka/... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

10. https://twitter.com/LuchoOrtiz77/st... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

11. https://medium.com/crypto-punks/how... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

12. /r/bitfinex - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

13. https://twitter.com/JimBTC/status/8... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is

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Muh free market anarchy

REEEE I WILL SUE YOU 4 DAMAGES!!!1

I see... so does that mean people borrowed money from Bitfenix to do trades, and then Bitfenix called in those loans when things went a bit south?

Always enjoy the crypto drama like.

I mean, I don’t understand any of it, but I can’t look away.

Say a share is worth $100.
You have $25, you find someone who put up the other $75. Together you buy a share.
That share drops in value dramatically and is now worth $12.
The person who put up the $75 sells the share losing his entire $75 and 13 of your dollars. He expects you to pay that $13.

Multiply that by a lot. Like a real lot.
Some dipshit loses $40K, because that was what he put in. Said dipshit expects the person who put up the rest to cover his losses because he doesn't know how these things work.
Ever hear of the great depression. This is how that happened.

Mostly correct except in this scenario as soon as the share started crashing the "other someone" which in this case is he exchange would sell the share. You lose most of your money while the other person is usually protected.

So in reality your $25 is gone while the other person keeps their $75. It's essentially a scam targeted at stupid people.

Margin trading is buying assets (like buttcoin) with money borrowed from a broker. The collateral in case of default would be the asset itself. You usually have to contribute a certain percentage to your margin account while the lender contributes the rest. The riskier the asset is, your contribution percentage is higher. Your margin account has a minimum maintinence value of money.

If the asset you hold plummets in value, it can go below that minimum value, so your lender issues a margin call. You're responsible for putting money in your margin account to bring it back to the minimum value. If you don't do anything, the lender can liquidate, or sell the asset to prevent further losses.

The kicker is that margin accounts are pretty heavily regulated at the federal level with regards to how much an investor must contribute, so who knows how screwed coiners can get if they're doing this through an unregulated medium.

TLDR: buy buttcoin with some borrowed money, buttcoin plummets, money lender sells buttcoin and butter loses money

rekt

Someone else explained the margin calls, but it looks like a lot of them lost money on stop losses, too.

A stop loss is usually a good idea. It's there to limit how much money you lose. Say you buy X (stock, BTC, whatever) for $10 each. You know prices might drop, so you set a stop loss at $9 each. That means if the price of X drops to $9, your account will automatically try to sell X.

The idea is you want to minimize how much money you lose, so you're willing to eat a loss of $1 on each X (in case maybe the price is on its way to like $5).

Flash crashes and a loss of liquidity (people buying, in this case) really fuck up basic stop losses, though.

Say you set the stop loss price at $9. That's all well and good, but to sell X at $9 someone else has to be willing to buy X at $9. If not, the stop loss mechanism is to keep looking for the next highest price to sell at.

You're hoping that next price is at like $8.99, but no one is buying at $8.99, it'll keep looking. If the highest price it finds a buyer is willing to pay is $2, guess what? It's selling X at $2.

The flash crash caused a whole bunch of sells because of the stop losses. Those sells used up all off the available prices open buy orders that were near a reasonable price, causing the price to drop, triggering even more stop loss sells and dropping the price like a rock until the buy orders started flowing in to recover it.

(The stock market has shit like market makers that combat such things. Crypto markets don't.)

This is exactly what happened on Black Monday. I'm surprised no one saw this coming including the exchange.

Black Monday (1987)

In finance, Black Monday refers to Monday, October 19, 1987, when stock markets around the world crashed, shedding a huge value in a very short time. The crash began in Hong Kong and spread west to Europe, hitting the United States after other markets had already declined by a significant margin. The Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell exactly 508 points to 1,738.74 (22.61%). In Australia and New Zealand, the 1987 crash is also referred to as "Black Tuesday" because of the time zone difference.

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Add in the fact that whales manipulate the market to cause crashes in order to fill buy orders at a fraction of the cost and you have what essential amounts to a scam on gullible buyers

If people arent coming out ahead with cryptocurrency, they need to have a conservator handle their finances for the rest of their life because they are retarded.

what do you mean? is it fairly easy to gain (I mean aside from mining)

They have been mostly shooting upwards lile a rocket for like 6 years now, it's really hard to lose money when literally any investment in it gains value at unheard of rates when compared to stocks.

You're still a fucking moron if you do this with your emergency fund and/or life savings though.

I'm some one who will be investing in this market in the near future (days) and I agree, don't fucking invest money that you wouldn't be willing to set on fire.

Or back up your positions with puts, it's cheap insurance. Is there an options market for buttcoin?

Not for the most part as far as I can tell. They barely have margin trading, much less options.

Holy fuck, then yeah that market is dodgy as fuck. I assume there are people willing to loan you shares so you can short, or is that not a thing yet?

You can short, but I don't think it's as straightforward as it is with a typical brokerage. Haven't done it myself so the specifics are fuzzy, though.

I think I'll stay the hell away from it. I've made enough day trading this year as it is.

These angry people should be angry w themselves for recklessly spending an amount they can't laugh off on effectively get-rich-quick schemes.

The issue is that these dumbasses trade on margin and this happens every. fucking. time. I trade a lot at bitmex and they allow to loan up to 100x of what you put in. The caveat is that you'll get force liquidated in a .4% or so swing against your position. I see daily retards crying over how they lost everything and manipulation and whales caused them to lose their money. If they were actually the geniuses they claim to be they wouldn't trade high margin without nothing wtf they're doing.

But setting it on fire is so much more fun.

I'm sure you've done your research but in case you haven't you should know that a market crash is inevitable precisely because of this unprecedented growth. It's not a question of if the market will crash, but rather a question of when.

Honestly the time to invest in crypto currency was 2-6 years ago. There are just too many people jumping on the bandwagon at this point.

But in the end it's your money. Good luck

How does this make sense. The more people buy, the more the value Increases, so why is people buying bad for investing?

Because demand is not infinite.

Apparently it's pretty hard to get actual money back tho

no no no they were told to hold and thats what theyre going to do, its sound advice and hey whered it all go

Time in the market is netter than failing at timing the market.

🤔

It’s almost like you know that you got lucky.

You are triggered and searching through my post history for something to condemn me with. Pathetic!

Hahaha, that you just got triggered by my spending 3 minutes to scroll back before the crash and see how your predictions look should be telling.

But someone as arrogant and dense as you will of course do anything to draw attention away from the fact that they were completely wrong about things.

Your technical understanding ob blockchain tech is equivalent to a squirrels understanding of plots in your favorite hentai.

We need to mobilise and take action. They cannot play games with peoples lives.

Yes they can, /u/bigtimeexpress, and you and your buddies can't do a thing about it, because you are trading the equivalent of magical beans with companies that are based in other countries entirely.

>Anarchy, fuck yeah!

>Hey, wtf why are those people fucking me over?

But if they complain...they will just give them their money back? Right? Lol

When these currencies started to take off Hong Kong and Taiwan must have made a new holiday

i wouldnt even be making fun of them if they werent so smug and self assured over what amounts to internet poker

Internet poker is a much safer way to make money than trying to play 30k in cryptocurrency tbqh. I could put 30k on cake and play fucking internet blackjack and it'd probably be a safer investment.

This is good for ETH.

Ohh man I am not so good with computer pls help!!

[deleted]

I mean they haven't lost all their money unless they were really dumb and thought $10k was the time to buy in

The problem with bitcoin is that it looks like an easy way for lazy shits to get rich with little work. I wouldn't be surprised if some people did in fact put more money than they really should have into it. Its why they are having a meltdown about it, all those UB40 payments are gone (thats an old reference, but fuck you)

But they're not gone unless they're retards who cash out while at a loss, or are especially unlucky and have cashed in at the exact point it peaked (unlikely but possible)

They investments are gone because the retards in question were engaging in margin trading, which is essentially a super risky get rich quick scheme. So a crash means they lose almost everything. Idiots.

They have lost most of their money because they were margin trading.

I guess u are just commenting without understanding and analysing the current situation. People have lost their coins when they were just sitting in the exchange without any orders. Go read more complaint threads before more people laugh at you

Oh, we're laughing, /u/Meowoao_: But at YOU. Partially because your grammar is attrocious, so I don't know how you expect anyone, let alone Bitfinex, to take you seriously. Mostly, though, we're laughing at you because it is YOU who utterly fail to understand the situation. You entrusted large amounts of money to a third party in a foreign country, and you spent that money on literally an imaginary invisible product - and what's worse, you borrowed money to do so. Ever tried to initiate an international lawsuit? I'm going to guess you haven't. Since you lost all your money anyhow, I don't know how you'll even get to the stage of paying to file.

Look at the bright side, Wall street and some bankers likely made a fortune

You know, the people that bitcoin was CLEARLY aimed at helping

Not Wall Street, foreign companies in china have made a fortune off these retards

BitCoin is masturbation without genitals.

This kind of thing always (((warms my cold heart)))

The kvetching of sheygetzim is music to my ears.

Guise, you're supposed to double down any loss that way the next big win will put you back into profit land. This is basic poker strategy. Good thing I invested solely in dodgecoin, to the moon!

I mean this is actually a legit strategy if you believe the stock is going to recover at least 50% of the ground it lost. It's called averaging down your cost basis. But when you are a retard and you put your entire life savings in a single buy and then it crashes, well then you're fucked buddy boi.

And now the TAX MAN COMETH http://fortune.com/2017/11/29/irs-coinbase/

What's more is, Coinbase requires you to provide a copy of your ID if you're gonna be trading in the mucho dinero.

Truly a glorious day for the crypto-hate subreddits!

I don't think anyone hates crypto currency. Its just amusing seeing pump and dump schemes with extra steps.

I hate cryptocurrency. Mostly because blockchain technology will lead to more Cayman Island and Panama style money laundering because it's more secure.

Right now almost every bank in existence is making money through their regular techniques, so there's no need for any traditional bank to get in on blockchain technology (especially when some banks are still running on fucking Windows 3.1 software because it works)

I don't hate the currency. I do hate the morons who act like it's the greatest thing ever.

there was a dude like a week ago that sold his car to buy part of a bitcoin with it, everyone was praising him on how smart an idea it was and how he can totally just buy a tesla to replace it in a year

i cant really feel bad for that level of retarded

Depends where he is trading it. If the bitcoin just sat in his wallet its more valuable now then it was when he bought it. current value is at 9883.11 thats up 4000 dollars if he bought on november 13th when the last low happened.

yeah technically he could maybe make a profit but lets be real he wont

Bitcoin and crypto currency trading is just a next generation get rich quick scheme designed to take advantage of gullible morons.

And I don't give a fuck if these morons lose money but they go around spouting their bullshit everywhere trying to convince other people to join in on the Ponzi scheme.

Cryptards are literally retarded

You mean I can't get my money back after giving it to a shady organization with flimsy security and nothing backing it other than the trust anonymous internet people put into it? No fair.

So let me get this straight. I don’t understand any of this. But it sounds like you trade getting the benefit of buying assets with someone else’s money by shouldering the liability that someone else gets to sell those assets and at low prices without your consent or approval. Is that right?

You can borrow money to buy investments with at some interest rate.

However, to get the loan, the lender also sets a requirement for how much of it you have to be able to cover (say, 25%). If the price drops enough that your total investment value drops below it, the borrower can demand you deposit enough money to meet the requirement.

If it drops even more, the lender can actually sell off your assets to recover their costs since you might be going bust.

How margin works on bitfinex:

• Users puts up their coins for x% lending rate.

• Margin User adds the collateral (USD, any margin enabled coins/tokens) to his margin wallet

• Margin User can now lend up to 3.33x the worth of his collateral from the lending pool.

What does this mean then? Well, if you have 100k and open a 333k position and it loses more than 15% of its value, it will get force liquidated. (15% would be ~50k). Bitfinex's trading engine would try to match the order immediately to highest available bid close to the liquidation point.

Lending out is very safe but there is a small risk in the event that pretty much all margin positions get wiped out and bitfinex's reserve can't cover it that lenders will lose their assets, since neither the user nor bitfinex can pay them back.

What happened here specifically my guess is that a lot of users held their collateral in BTC or another coin, and when BTC dips as hard as it did so quickly pretty much all alts will dip even harder.

So imagine that you hold your 100k in BTC when you open your margin position. BTC went down 20%+ yesterday from its highest point. Already only your collateral has lost 20% of its value and you have lost 40% of your margin maintenance. And we're not yet counting the margin position he had in whatever coin. That'd mean he would get force liquidated if he lost 30k or more on a 333k position, which is ~9%. Well, if BTC drops 20% most alts probably drop 25-30%, which is way beyond the margin maintenance point.

Boom. A cascade of liquidations has just been triggered and the whole bid book will pretty much get wiped out if a lot of margin longs are open. This is common whale tactics used EVERY. FUCKING. TIME. the whole crypto market goes up so much in a very short timeframe. Stop loss/liquidation hunting will always happen in crypto but retards only see the $ sign and think they're fucking geniuses "because it can only go up right".

Then they go to reddit, twitter, trollboxes etc and complain how the exchange stole their money unfairly when they have no fucking idea what margin trading entails. I thank them for their contribution though, I've bought up a lot of liquidations this year.

Hey guys sorry it was me selling all of my coins.