New tax plan hurts those in blue states making more than 200K. r/California has a reasonable discussion on tax policy.

99  2017-12-06 by Lawgustmarck

283 comments

Friendly reminder that trickle down economics is not a thing, and that it's a shitty political term used by left wingers (who have actually convinced themselves that it actually exists) to attack anything remotely pro-market (that they don't advocate for at the current time)

Trickle down theory is a real economic theory. It's been proven to be ineffective.

It's actually been proven effective in situations where you can actually expect and have those at the top spending and investing locally.

That doesn't really work anywhere anymore though...

/seriouspost

"It's actually been proven effective..."

Communism has also been proven effective in small groups.

The problem is, just like with communism the whole premise of the theory breaks down because that's not actual how people behave in the free market. It's a pipe dream.

it has proven

I know it's retarded slang but it's Past tense

work

Present tense

You're typing argumentatively while agreeing with me...

Not my problem that you perceive my comments to be in disagreement, I was only stating facts

It absolutely is a thing. It's an economic theory. One that has been proven to be ineffective.

You are correct that the term is used to degrade any pro-business bills

No it isn't. No economist believes in it. It's a shitty political term

I have a degree in economics. It's a real economic theory.

I do too, no it isn't. You should know this as well. Here's a little explanation for you [1] [2]

"They are not reaching trickle down economics in universities."

Wrong right off the bat. That takes some talent.

They literally fucking don't.

Better call up my old prof and remind him how he totally didn't cover trickle down economics in his class

What did he say exactly? And for what class?

Look dude, it's a economic theory, okay? Whether or not it works is up for debate, but it is a fucking THEORY

It's not real, it's a strawman. Seriously. I have no doubt in my mind some lefty economic professor taught it believing that it's actually advocated for by the right, but it's not.

Well, it literally fucking isn't. All it is, is a political term. Sooooo

JUST BECAUSE YOU DON'T LIKE IT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S NOT A THING

HOW SELF ABSORBED ARE YOU

HOW SELF ABSORBED EDUCATED ARE YOU

Enough to know that it's just a shitty political term that really doesn't even mean anything.

/r/iamverysmart

Thx for the economic run down friendo. Go back to getting fucked by Muhammad you british cuck

It's not r/iamverysmart

It's r/ihavetheremotestunderstandingofwhateconomicsactuallyis

Just because you say it doesn't make it true

Well I've linked to a bunch of explanation from econ phd's

So have I

Lol

Pro market? Is that what we’re calling slanted towards the rich now?

No it's what we call bills that promote the exchange of goods in the market. Tax cuts do that. Trust busting does that.

Where do you think the government's spending goes? Look up MPC and the income multiplier. Tax cuts for the rich are much more likely to go towards hookers and blow than food stamps.

Yeah but how else are those high class hookers supposed to get paid?

Hookers and blow are consumption. And while MPC has the multiplier effect, the reverse side is MPS. Saving = investments. And in the long run the economy can only grow with investments.

Hookers and blow are goods being consumed thus injecting money back into the economy, your argument is less you're angry at tax breaks for the rich and more that you don't like where the rich spend their money because it doesn't directly benefit you and your ideals.

Hey you're the tard from /r/ShitPoliticsSays

SALT BELOW

Trickle down my economic bby 😍😍💦💦💦😩

Those poor, poor limousine liberals and their paltry 200k per year. If they get taxed much more they might even have to move out of their ivory towers.

They’d have to leave their apartments in hipster heaven SF and live amongst the uninformed mongloids! REEEeeeeee!

They might have to be near an illegal immigrant!

Undocumented migrant. Gtfo outta here with that hate speech.

I want them quarantined in NY and Cali, I don't want those retards moving to middle america and infecting it.

I know, you guys might have to start actually working.

You don't know what ivory tower means do you?

That complete lack of self awareness... Holy shit.

"Raise taxes on the rich! Make them pay!"

Taxes are being raised for the top 2 percent of income earners. Anyone with an income of more than $200,000 will pay more in taxes.

"I didn't mean me, you dumb fucks! I meant the rich!"

People forget that even social heavens like Sweden being at bottom tier still has effective tax rate 40-50%.

In fairness, you do get a lot of shit for free just living in Sweden. I'm not sure it's worth the tradeoff, but it's a legitimate choice.

Democrats in this country want a similar level of taxation, but instead of actual healthcare and free college, they're just going to force you to buy the same shitty healthcare you've already rejected (because it's expensive and won't cover anything), and want to send you to SJW factories instead of giving you a real education.

"In fairness", it's not free. It's paid for by the tax payer.

College shouldn’t be free but even sensible degrees cost a fuckton and you can’t get rid of that debt even if you die

It actually depends on the person. If you don't like working and getting free shit then it is the best place. But if you are workaholic and alcoholic then it is the shittiest.

Democrats never seem to mention that "free college" in Europe usually means "free, assuming your grades and test scores are high enough or else enjoy your lovely career in the trades college."

Also European unis are fucking terrible. Literally the only places with any quality are British or Swiss (i.e., not in the EU).

Britain is in the EU, has been for decades, and still will be for another year or two.

And there are plenty of good European universities Americans don't know about because they don't teach in English.

There's not a single quality European uni outwith CH and the UK. Not one. Fucking Singapore alone has more top-tier unis than your entire dying continent.

Come to grips with the fact your entire castrated continent and civilisation hasn't been relevant since Hitler. Then kill yourself while listening to insufferable dance music.

I mean, you're just straight-up fuckin' incorrect, but whatever...

I mean, I'm just straight-up fuckin' not.

Fucking Singapore has more top-tier unis than the whole of the non-UK EU. Cry harder that your entire civilisation hasn't been relevant since Hitler, eurocuck.

ooh, nice goalpost moving. Heads up, dude, most people don't go to Harvard or Yale, they go to shitty scum-tier colleges in rural Ohio or whatever. Still, you're probably still 16 or something, so keep up the good work and I'm sure with your insight and broad knowledge you'll find out for yourself. If you're lucky.

Not to mention that most of the good universities in the US are in blue states.

Also it’s pretty easy to get a scholarship here in the states if you made decent grades. Especially if you’re not white or Asian.

The waivers and grants alone can literally pay for someone's entire education. You have to be retarded to pay what is quoted.

'cept those are going to be taxable income under the new bill

I got into a pretty nice college with grades so bad it was actually kind of funny. What they're really looking for is someone who will consistently pay them lots of money and probably not detonate a bomb during class one day. A 4.0 is more an indicator that you take education seriously enough to not default on your loan than anything.

You need high grades and test courses to get in American college so it’s still better

No you don't. JCs will take anyone who graduated high school, and some 4 year schools don't have much higher standards.

What's wrong with that? If you don't cut it you shouldn't be able to take a spot from somebody smarter than you just because your family has money or influence.

In Norway at least, people with shit grades are allowed to try to improve them anyway, but they have to pay for it themselves because they screwed it up the first time. The cost is about $100 per subject (used to be $50, but then a lot of people didn't show up for the exam.).

I don't think there is anything wrong with that. I'm merely pointing out that the "free college just like Europe" crowd here tends to gloss over the "for qualified students only" bit.

To be fair, that's a bait and switch I can get behind.

Oh. Then its worth mentioning that if you drop out or fail your classes you have to pay back 100% of your student loans (like 15k yearly for living expenses at government run institutions, and added tuition if you go to a private one) instead of like 65% if you pass. Higher education here is pretty ok, but if you go just to fuck around it will cost you a bit.

This is more or less the same situation we face now. Not anyone can just roll into the state schools anymore. Applying to college has gotten insanely competitive.

want to send you to SJW factories instead of giving you a real education

Maybe we should start investing into public education at the K-12 level so kids don't end up spouting idiocy like this.

lol

He's not wrong, if we start indoctrinating at an earlier age we would see fewer objections.

Just put estrogen straight into the diaper linings.

In fairness, you do get a lot of shit for free just living in Sweden

Yes, get raped, mostly.

a lot of shit for free just living in Sweden

Halal rapes, for instance.

Sjw factories? That’s just a conservative caricature that doesn’t reflect actual reality

I know. Sometimes being on reddit is like watching Fox News with my grandma.

and want to send you to SJW factories instead of giving you a real education.

You might want to check out Swedish Universities some time

My taxes will go up about $3,000 due to the SALT deduction removal and I don't make anywhere near $200,000 a year.

If you itemize your tax returns, most Americans won't have much sympathy for you.

Understand that as a result of Obama's shitty handling of the 2007 crash, the most common wage in America is about 25k a year. More than 50% of Americans make that, or less. That's the issue with inequality--to over 50% of America, you're still 'the rich'.

Honestly, it's only going to go up. You've got three options: disenfranchise, actual work on income inequality, or slowly watch your country descend into communism. The first will probably cause a lot of terrorism in a country where mass shootings are already common (largely due to the social anomie caused by men unable to earn enough to attract a wife or have a valid place in society. The second will cause real political reforms, as the current system encourages nothing but obeying the wealthy until the entire thing explodes. And the third...well, honestly, that's where we're going. Communism wasn't actually considered a 'big thing' 10-20 years ago like it is now, and the 2007 crash (or more accurately, this political systems complete refusal to respond to it) is largely responsible for that

Are you memeing or is this real?

Yes

Obama's shitty handling of the 2007 crash

I'd love to hear your "critique" of his economic policies. Funny enough, many of them were inherited from the GWB administration.

Funny enough, many of them were inherited from the GWB administration.

in my non-expert opinion im pretty comfortable saying that might have something to do with the issue

People who unironically think they're smarter than GWB while having accomplished nothing in their pathetic lives should neck themselves. Dude made some decisions I don't like but he's genuinely probably smarter than both of us combined.

youre conflating intelligence with virtue in a really weird way

also old people are all senile fools so hes probably only barely smarter than us

Understand that as a result of Obama's shitty handling of the 2007 crash, the most common wage in America is about 25k a year

Source? Your ass lmao. This is r/drama. There are no real experts on politics and economics. Calm down.

Source? Your ass.

This is what happens when we go overboard with praising bussy.

lol

According to factcheck.org, if you're taking the SALT deduction, you're probably "rich enough."

Higher-income households are more likely to itemize, so they are more likely to claim the [SALT] deduction. “About 10 percent of tax filers with incomes less than $50,000 claimed the SALT deduction in 2014, compared with about 81 percent of tax filers with incomes exceeding $100,000,” the Tax Policy Center says in a brief on the topic.

How did you figure that out? Ive looked for some online calculators to figure out the difference for me but I get wildly different results

Took last year's state tax I deducted and looked at 35% of that and came up with that number.

Yes but you might get more from the new standard deduction and other changes. Im not a fan of the plan, just trying to figure out how to calculate all this shit.

I won't. My itemized deductions are higher, still.

In general I wouldn't mind it that much except for the fact that if I knew this was coming, I might have held off on buying a house. I budgeted things out a certain way expecting certain deductions and that benefit is getting reduced quite a bit.

Have a feeling property values will go down because of this, as well.

Yeah, I live in NY and am trying to buy a house in CT. Either state, Im getting royally fucked on property taxes and state taxes as deductions.

not when those taxes are going to subsidize those making over 500,000 and to repeal the estate tax.

This tax bill is not about workers. It is about giving shareholders and businesses lower taxes and merely hoping benefits will trickle down. We have seen this play out again and again, showing that this type of policy does not work.

Also, isn't wealth transfer anathema to republicans? Also, their is so much pork in this thing it is disgusting. They are literally writing in the margins of the bill. One thing I can tell you definitively is that corporations will win, and the american public, especially future generations (or even when you are going to retire) are going to get fucked.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/01/us/politics/hand-scribbled-tax-bill-outcry.html

Nothing expressed in that bullshit opinion takes away from the fact that a bunch of rich people screaming "eat the rich" are bitching about about being put on the menu.

To be blunt, I really have no sympathy for someone in the top three percent of household income shitting on the top one percent for being "too rich."

Also, the left has never accepted "I don't like what my tax dollars are being used for" whenever they are raising taxes. As far as I'm concerned, this is yet another case of

"B-b-but it's different when we do it"

that has become the hallmark of the American left.

You're missing the part where rich people making over $200k in red states are getting a tax cut, but people making over $200k in California or New York are getting a tax hike. It's legislation finely tuned to hurt Democrat voters only.

You're missing the part where red states aren't taxing the fuck out of their residents, and blue states are. If you are going to see your tax burden spike if the SALT deduction goes away, it's because your state and local governments need to lower their taxes.

You're missing the part where red states aren't taxing the fuck out of their residents

Texas does, it's a red state with high taxes - property taxes. But conveniently, the GOP tax bill still allows property taxes to be deducted. So that Texas, a GOP state can benefit. Because the head of the GOP controlled House Ways and Means committee is from Texas, a red state.

Which proves this isn't some principled change in tax policy, it's weaponization of the tax code against blue states.

Then those cucks need to write their state and tell them to lower taxes. How the fuck is it you think republicans are responsible for high as fuck state taxes? Are you retarded or just LARPing as one

Nah, the old rules were fine - they allowed states to fund their infrastructure without drastically raising the tax burden of the population.

And in the end, states like NY and CA - some of the losers in this bill, are some of the few that actually pain into the system instead of useless leech red states that gloat about low taxes, while taking handouts to stay alive.

How the fuck is it you think republicans are responsible for high as fuck state taxes?

Texas is a red state with high taxes - property taxes. But conveniently, the GOP tax bill still allows property taxes to be deducted. So that Texas, a red state can benefit. Because the head of the GOP controlled House Ways and Means committee represents Texas, a red state.

Which proves this isn't some principled change in tax policy, it's weaponization of the tax code against blue states.

Oh lord cut the partisan crap will you?

$200k is middle class in my area, that's a working professional's wage, usually with a high cost of living to go with it. Most people here are ok with paying more taxes, and redistributive policies in general. They aren't ok paying more taxes to offset a tax cut for the super wealthy, and those of equal earners in other states. You don't need to pretend that's the same thing, or that it's somehow weird that people feel this way.

As for local taxes being the problem - well, that is generally how you build a state that actually produces more than it takes in. Even with the deductions - states like NY and CA were carrying the rest of you leeches.

$200k is middle class in my area

Hopefully you've already built gates, the raids to eat your rich bitch ass are coming.

There isn't all that much to take. At $200k most people still here still rent. You're better off raiding where $200k makes you rich.

You must own a lot of useless shit if you make 200k and one of the things you own isn't your house.

Sounds like a great place to raid.

Yeah that's how it works bwahaha. Jesus, you'd make a shit viking. There are whole towns around here where the median home price is well north of four mil, and you want to raid mid-grade techies with no assets to speak of.

$200k is middle class in my area

200k is middle class everywhere in America but you're still going to be considered rich by the jobless liberal arts majors calling for higher taxes. You can try to reason with them and tell them you couldn't even afford the townhouse with the terrace and your Mercedes doesn't have massaging seats but they aren't going to listen to you.

I guess I meant more like lower middle "probably shouldn't have a family on that income" class.

$200k is middle class in my area

Calling shenanigans on this. What is your area?

[removed]

First of all, the guy making 160k is 20% lower than the 200k in your comment.

He's also just scraping by.

I'm assuming SF is actually your area, then, based on your reply. The median salary in SF is $77k/year. How can you qualify a salary that's 2.6x the median as middle class? It isn't Oprah rich, but it isn't middle class. It's obtuse to think so.

That's because you don't understand how people live in SF. The median wage being what it is, and it's basic incompatibility with the cost of living in the area, is a problem. Some, view it as a crisis.

Another study, by Attom Data Solutions in January, calculated that renters in the Marin County/San Francisco metro area will spend more than 77 percent of their salary, on average, to pay rent in 2017. The national average is 38.7 percent.

People are dogpiling into apartments - but that is not a middle class existence.

https://i.imgur.com/w7wGJUf.jpg

If all you can afford to rent is a modest two-bedroom apartment - you're not wealthy.

[removed]

Realistically, to not live in a shithole in SF, you need to be making well over 100k - and at that point you're likely to be still be sharing an apt. 200k is not the bare-minimum to have a middle class lifestyle in SF, but it's nowhere near enough to be wealthy. Everyone who makes 200k in SF, or Bay Area in general, is very much middle class.

Because again, if you define it by requiring a 2 BR in city center then we're past the discussion of middle class.

If you can't afford a decent 3br in a building that isn't falling apart, you're not wealthy. You might not be poor, but you sure as shit haven't climbed out of middle class yet.

lol seriously. I wanted to comment "wtf I hate taxing the rich now" but wrongly assumed nobody would dislike this.

Taxes are being raised for the top 2 percent of income earners. Anyone with an income of more than $200,000 will pay more in taxes.

But that's clearly not what is happening here bwahaha.

Making more than 200k a year would put you in the top few percent, wouldn't it?

I think current US average is like $52,000?

That's median.

I thought that was the same thing? I don't know from math or econmics too good.

Average can mean median or mean. But in this case median is probably better.

Average is the sum of all the elements divided by the number of elements. The median is the value closest to the center of the sorted data set.

This explains why the median is $52,000

Breaking 60k puts you in the top 20% iirc

Top 3% according to Wikipedia.

I think 1% nationwide was 400k. I could be wrong. 200k is probably top 2-4ish.

AFAIR nationwide 1% is about to 200k, in California it might be 400k though.

Somewhere between the 80th & 95th percentile in CA: https://statisticalatlas.com/place/California/San-Francisco/Household-Income

The imaginary caricature rich liberals have dreamed up in their mind when they spout "tax the rich"

https://imgur.com/Vxr5GKR

The guy in the bottom is worth 2.3 billion and he made an app that connects to your Fitbit and sends you a funny gif every time your heart rates rockets above 150 from panic attacks.

I'mma make a billion dollars selling a punching bag that looks like that guy

this comment made me consider suicide.

Some idiot in that thread just unironically used the term "Obama era economic glow"

Holy fuck the delusion is nearly tangible.

I didn't see nuffin glow

Only thing that glowed during his president was small middle eastern villages after Obama's drone got through with them

If you can't see a difference between 2008 and 2016 economy you might be retarded.

Only took 9 trillion in debt for a moderate economic recovery. What a great economic decision!

Well I'm sure you will furrow your brow when you hear that this new tax plan is going to further extend our debt.

I'm not commenting on the new tax plan, I'm talking about Obamas retarded bailouts

You're both fucking retarded. The smart move would just be to print more money until the debt is gone. The US has the capability of printing hundreds of thousands of dollars per day: if it wasnt for the Jewish elite restricting money production we would all be rich.

It really says something about Reddit that I'm not sure if you're kidding or not

Because you are retarded.

Weak

Your ability to detect overt satire is.

"I www only pretending to be retarded"

Not an argument

Quiet retard kys

Weak

omg haha

I'm talking about Obamas retarded bailouts

This was... Bush. And it's well regarded as a success. Where did you get your meme degree?

Bush did one bailout, Obama did several. Tired of educating you braindead sluts

Where did you get your meme degree?

Still never answered this. Also the stimulus was very successful.

I'm under no obligation to give some sperggie on the internet personal info.

Also The stimulus was a horrible failure if you consider the amount of money added onto our national debt.

Also The stimulus was a horrible failure if you consider the amount of money added onto our national debt.

Welcome to macro 101. Your first lesson is to not think of the government like a household.

Yes I'm sure there is no downside to adding 9 trillion to our deficit.

Friend, you're throwing a number out like it means something. What's the debt-to-GDP?

Funny this guy can't talk about anything above a high school text book.

DEGREEEEE IN ECONOMICS

You're aware that as long as the government can make interest payments more debt is good? It's not like a credit card.

Uh yeah, I'm not the one who said national debt is more important than economic growth.

uh huh definitely retarded

I have a degree in economics, what are your qualifications?

I like where this is going.

not but a reading of freakonomics but do i really need a degree to call you a retard on /r/drama ?

Oh, so you just want a slap fight?

Fine I unironically hope a jungle demon turns your insides to mush by brutally raping your corpse.

Which economic theory does jungle demon rape fall under? With your degree I expect a quality answer.

Socialism.

Keynesian

also you being disingenuous lil' fagget failing to mention dubyas 2009 budget plan and the emergency funds that congress passed during the recession

Oh yes silly me I forgot whatever bad happened under Obama is Bush's fault and everything good happening under Trump is also Obamas doing.

Is u/froibo a regular or lolcow we summoned, I don't want to downvote a lolcow but seriously people that retarded shouldn't be permitted to breed

I've been downvoting him because he's not a lolcow, just a straight retard.

If he had anything to contribute besides "lol ur retarded" I would encourage him, but he's just boring tbh

Hmmmmmm

WAAAAAAH WHY WON'T ANY OF THE ECONOMICS LEADERS SUPPORT WHAT I'M SAYING

I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:

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I'll have you know that /u/froibo has a degree in economics, what are your qualifications?

You're a little late to the party friendo. Get delayed at the anal plug store?

Yeah they had trouble finding my size.

Yeah most stores don't carry torpedoes in stock

Torpedos yeeesh I wish my bussy was that tight. You must use kegels. Only using soviet submarines over here champ

Typhoon class?

Lets just say I conducted my own personal hunt for The Red October ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

You are defending a guy that sounds a lot like he is spurting out libertarian economics. I hope you are proud of yourself.

Get fucked libcuck

:(

he's a regular

upvote him anyway you're on /r/drama faggot

I down vote regulars

Post bussy

Mmmmmmmm thanks for the tasty pasta

Debt usually grows faster when you're taking in less tax revenue, something that tends to happen during recessions.

Recessions and recoveries occur naturally in our economy.

The economic cycle is: upturn, downturn, recovery, and depression. It's a naturally occurring cycle. What you DON'T do is bail out too big to fail banks and businesses like Obama did. We almost universally agree that this was a horrible decision.

What you DON'T do is bail out too big to fail banks and businesses like Obama did.

No one agrees with that. The entire country would have been bankrupted.

Bush did one bailout.

Obama did several bailouts.

You're actually talking out of your ass. I would suggest sticking with shitposting because you might have a chance of winning an argument like that.

It was a complete bipartisan effort. Show me a respected economist that said the banks should have been allowed to fail.

-every economist who understands the free market

Uh huh.

Show me a respected economist

a respected economist

respected economist

Mind blown. You have just taking trolling to epic proportions, congratulations sir.

The economic cycle is: upturn, downturn, recovery, and depression.

......lol

Care to explain why you disagree?

That's right you can't explain. Because I actually studied this shit for years and you're just spewing shit out of gloryhole you call a mouth.

I disagree because it's a vast oversimplification.

I am highly dubious that you actually "studied this shit for years".

He has an economic degree that he printed from the internet.

So you don't actually disagree? You're just stirring the waters because I had to dumb it down for the Reddit mouth breathers?

Where did you get your armchair degree in economics?

Where did you get your degree in economics? Wait you don't have one?

Do you even have a degree?

Yes?

Did you major in butthurt with a minor in bussyblasting?

Weak

There's no substance to your statement with which to disagree. You can't "dumb down" something which didn't mean anything in the first place.

Here, let me try:

Humans are: water, carbon, and nitrogen. Trust me on this, I've studied this shit on Wikipedia for years.

The point of my comment was that recessions and recoveries occur naturally in the economy. Do you disagree with that?

Do you disagree with that?

It's another non-statement. Deaths occur naturally among human populations. This statement is of virtually no use to anyone. Likewise is the assertion that economic health is sinusoidal. What matters is the nature of these variations and their context.

In your original comment you spat out a non-statement to introduce your tangential opinion about the Economic Stabilization Act. It was the verbal equivalent of you fucking up a slight of hand.

r/iamverysmart

Tell us more about your degree.

Self-awareness clearly is not your strong suit.

accuses me of writing meaningless text

writes two paragraphs of iamverysmart nothingburger

> "nothingburger"

This alone warrants the death sentence.

Well come and carry out your sentence bitch

What the darn-diddily-doodily did you just say about me, you little witcharooney? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class at Springfield Bible College, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret mission trips in Capital City, and I have over 300 confirmed baptisms. I am trained in the Old Testament and I’m the top converter in the entire church mission group. You are nothing to me but just another heathen. I will cast your sins out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before in Heaven, mark my diddily-iddilly words. You think you can get away with saying that blasphemy to me over the Internet? Think again, friendarino. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of evangelists across Springfield and your IP is being traced by God right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggorino. The storm that wipes out the diddily little thing you call your life of sin. You’re going to Church, kiddily-widdily. Jesus can be anywhere, anytime, and he can turn you to the Gospel in over infinity ways, and that’s just with his bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in preaching to nonbelievers, but I have access to the entire dang- diddily Bible collection of the Springfield Bible College and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your sins away off the face of the continent, you diddily-doo satan-worshipper. If only you could have known what holy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you from the Heavens, maybe you would have held your darn-diddily-fundgearoo tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re clean of all your sins, you widdillo-skiddily neighborino. I will sing hymns of praise all over you and you will drown in the love of Christ. You’re farn-foodily- flank-fiddily reborn, kiddo-diddily.

Which turn around at a more consistent pace when you don't pump in bad money. Temporary measures create temporary jobs. All they did was basically shift the problem down the line.

What constitutes "bad money"?

Furthermore, what "temporary measures" are you talking about?

By bad money I mean debt. The temporary measures I am talking about was the money the federal government pumped into a bunch of "green tech" companies to try and jumpstart that sector and a lot of public works projects that fizzled out after three years.

pumped into a bunch of "green tech" companies to try and jumpstart that sector

a lot of public works projects

What bills and programs are you referring to specifically and how much total debt did these two contribute to the federal budget?

I’m on mobile and can’t remember the exact numbers. Everything is dwarfed by military and social spending, that doesn’t mean it doesn’t add up. Government exists to protect the people, so anything above that should be seen as add ons.

Your original comments make it seem as though these policies are creating lots of problems for the future when the reality is that their impact will be minimal because they are minimal in the big picture.

Government exists to protect the people, so anything above that should be seen as add ons.

The government is like any other human social entity. It exists to perpetuate itself, just like a business, family, or organization does. Of course this is incredibly simplified, but I think it illustrates my point.

Google the laffer curve, retard. Any college freshman knows that shit.

The Laffer Curve is tangential to my comment. Given fixed expenditure, budget deficit increases when tax revenue decreases. This tax revenue decrease could be due to decreased economic activity from overtaxation (Laffer Curve) or it could be due to decreased economic activity during a recession (what my comment was talking about).

When you cut taxes the tax receipts always increase this is like a basic economics 101 fact.

Yeah...not disagreeing with you on that. Decreased taxes, increased public spending, or decreased economic activity all contribute to increasing budget deficits.

Cut taxes the economy roars to life, more taxes taken in. Every time. Liberals are idiots.

LOL okay dude take an entry level econ class at the very least and see how stupid that is to say.

First of all, my statement was a relative one. Many people think that tax policy is a predominant factor in economic performance. However, its role is over-inflated (mainly due to partisan politics).

Second of all, if you actually took your own advice you would learn that there are more important factors at play in macroeconomics, such as monetary cycles. If you want a prime example of this, see FDR's devaluation following the onset of the Great Depression. It was one of the few things he actually got right in that period. Luckily the NIRA was largely stymied before it could cause any real damage.

Pasta?

You can try. Doubt it will stick.

That stale, eh?

I can see a difference in the 2017 economy.

Oh I bet. 11 months later and the world suddenly is filled with butterflies and rainbows.

And money. And leftist breakdowns. Good stuff.

Amazing how we could recover so quickly after the worst depression the world ever faced in 2016.

There's no magic wand you can wave!

> liberal

> have money

Pick one.

Liberals dont live in the poor states, fam.

Liberals dont live

Ooh baby

Hey, it could be their daddy’s money.

here's the thing as blue state 1% that people just don't get - prostitutes are fucking expensive. 500K a year is not even as much as you think when your 1br appt is 3K per month and you blow like 5K a month and whores. I barely have enough left over to save even 100K a year.

Only 5k a month? What a pleb. Good bussy should run 10k a month at minimum. You must be getting that low grade gussy.

He doesn't even get the good gussy, he's still going after the common ones that will sleep with anyone!

Bussy is free

Well, your bussy is.....still no takers.

Only $10k a month? Pfft, I scoffed so hard at this that my monocle fell off.

They were for increasing taxes on the wealthy, before they were against it!

Live in a blue state.

Make over 200k.

Son'of'a'bitch I hate Trump now!

No really I hate the assholes in my blue state who raise taxes with no real returns for anyone except the corrupt and connected people.

Illinois?

Yea but I'm pretty sure it applies to any blue state.

I bailed last year. Enjoying my no income tax and paying less sales tax.

Texas? You guys are making it harder for me to get a nice house in the future REEEEEE.

Woah, woah. Look, I'm not the one buying out houses for more than they are worth just because I can like the damn commiefornians. I just want to live in a state that hass got good food, lots of guns, and isn't a bunch of whiny bitches 24/7.

Oh okay. You cool.

Since at least 5 years ago, we started getting Calis buying houses in cash. Since there are also lots of Chinese there, we are really seeing the damage they done around us.

The property taxes around Chicago are seriously insane. At least you can still deduct those, I guess.

Can someone explain to me why this only affects blue states? Genuinely don't know.

High income taxes and property taxes can't be written off like they used to be at the federal level.

Democrats love taxes, so the blue states are heavily taxed.

This is actually BAD for republcians. As it is blue state idiots leave their crappy tax states, move into areas like NV and TX and vote blue idiots in who raise taxes. This will accelerate liberal flight.

Imagine, one day, with enough liberals and infrastructure spending, NV and TX might pay more into the federal system than they take out. Wouldn't that be something?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_tax_revenue_by_state

¯\(ツ)

Blue, red, blue, red, blue blue red.

If only we had more urban poor to shift the red ones blue, amiright?

Federal tax revenue by state

This is a table of the total federal tax revenue by state collected by the U.S. Internal Revenue Service.

Gross collections indicates the total federal tax revenue collected by the IRS from each U.S. state, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico. The figure includes all individual and corporate income taxes, payroll taxes, estate taxes, gift taxes, and excise taxes. This table does not include federal tax revenue data from U.S. Armed Forces personnel stationed overseas, U.S. territories other than Puerto Rico, and U.S. citizens and legal residents living abroad, even though they may be required to pay federal taxes.


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Do you understand the difference between gross and net? CA and NY pay more than they take. Texas takes more than it pays.

Ok I just looked up that organization. It appears to be run by a Jew. I saw several clear Jewish biases. /u/Chicup is smarter than that, they had to know he'd be on to them. Sad.

Jeffrey Goldberg

Jeffrey Mark Goldberg (born September 22, 1965) is an American journalist and the editor-in-chief of The Atlantic. During his nine years at The Atlantic prior to becoming editor, Goldberg became known for his coverage of foreign affairs. He has won many awards and written eleven cover stories for the magazine.


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Texas is a red state with high property taxes.

California is a blue state with high income taxes.

The GOP wanted to ram through this legislation without having to negotiate any votes from democrats, so they wrote it to benefit red states like Texas (allow property tax deduction) to get the vote of GOP representatives from Texas, while paying for those cuts by raising taxes in blue states (remove income tax deduction), because they don't care about votes of Democrat representatives from California.

What do you do?

Sell propane and propane accessories.

"We need to tax the rich! No no don't tax us! Tax the other guys!"

if it hurts rich people I’m for it

Tfw you want to eat the rich but it turns out you are the rich.

Is that feeling also the feeling of being literally everyone on reddit?

Liberals 2015: Tax the rich!

Liberals 2016: lol red states are full of poors!

Liberals 2017: REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Best comment in this thread, tbh

I'll seriouspost: yes, it taxes upper middle class people more*, but it's a ruse to tax rich people more (while still having a big deficit).

I must admit it's a good ruse.

*that being said between taxes and overpriced houses that amount of money is less impressive

200K isn't exactly rich for some parts of California

For many, particularly those in Democratic areas who earn $200,000 or more, the increase would come from the repeal of the state and local tax deduction, known as SALT.

hahahahahahaha

wtf i love raising taxes now

Taxes are good, repukklicans dont want to raise taxes on the rich because they hate the poor