Social media decides that liberal Jewish professor is actually alt right

105  2018-01-12 by HivemindBuster

90 comments

The people involved here probably don't even respect bussy all that much.

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NYT does what the daily stormer did there on a near daily basis.

))))Horseshoe Theory((((

idk what that means

Not a real theory in politics, but instead an observation that extremists tend to be extreme.

You see no actual ideological overlap at the edges, but you do see a high degree of tactical agreement on things like murdering people who disagree with you. Thing is, you find that among extremists of even centrist ideologies. A whole lot of death squads got started by so-called 'Radical Centrist' neoliberals in the South America, for instance.

It's less a 'the left and right are crazy at the extremes', and more 'Anyone who believes in something too fervently is likely crazy'.

tl;dr: Angry mobs are so retarded it's hard to tell what side they're on.

NEOLIBERAL DEATH SQUADS

Day of the Horseshoe when

What about nihlists. lebowski?

If you are reading this you are alt-right.

Well I’m a radical centrist so fuck you

Found the alt-righter.

Literally (((Hitler)))

I serious pist on r/politics are you sure about that?

I serious post on r/politics are you sure about that?

Stopped reading there

Well that’s good because you appear to have quoted my whole reply.

Yeah I figured I would hear what you had to say

please keep yourself safe immediately

You first bb.

this but unironically.

Of course Jesse "I hate the trans, I call them mans" would try to cover for one of his fellow TERF Neo-Nazi friends

mobile.nytimes.com/2018/01/11/opinion/social-media-dumber-steven-pinker.html

accurate

(((MAGA!)))

Fuck this is depressing

Hitler was Right

but a vegetarian, so fuck him

he kept it on a down low, so still good.

Seriously, m8. Not only is the evil Jew's skin white, but so is his hair.

lurk more

That’s because the pernicious social dynamics of these online spaces hammer home the idea that anyone who disagrees with you on any controversial subject, even a little bit, is incorrigibly dumb or evil or suspect.

Shit... they're onto us, boys!

I disagree. Peak /r/drama is realizing that even if you agree with another user, you're both still retards.

INCORRIGIBLE!

informational Balkanization

Now there's a dog whistle. California secession when?

The best part of California secession? When American gets to invade and reconquer their retarded asses.

I'd sign up for that.

There is nothing about this idea I don't like.

You end up with California being a part of your country.

Set up a puppet state and rule via proxy.

Just to spite, build a wall, a nice big wall.

Make it circle around the state, then pour the water.

No matter what side they're on, Jews get hate. It's why we've learned never to trust you goyim under any circumstances. Either you're of the chosen people of Israel, or go fuck your mother.

This, but unironically.

oy vey

r/drama is like our internet israel.

SRDines are the Arabs

MDEtards are the migrants who manage to sneak over Bibi’s Egyptian border fence

And Hodor is that guy who starts talking about how Palestinians aren't real and Arabs are all descended from dog-people the moment he's had a few.

Did you know that Palestinians weren’t a people until 1967? Sounds crazy but it’s true! Now some say they appeared out of thin air but that’s an obvious lie. They were molded from clay and came to life when “Chai” was written across their foreheads.

MDEtards are the migrants who manage to sneak over Bibi’s Egyptian border fence

I'm 100% Ethiopian Jewish, bigot!

We elect Hitler just once and somehow we are the bad guys.

Hitler was never elected bud he was levered into power by desperate conservatives that thought they could control him and use him to dismantle the left.

He was elected after getting in power tho. He was put there by the conservatives, sure but he still got elected afterward.

Yeah, he was elected in a rigged election, not an actual election.

Nazi support was already in freefall by time he got put into power and they knew it. They knew they couldn't win an election.

Fair enough.

Don't let the goyim in on the secrets you putz. What happens in ZOG stays in ZOG.

No matter what side they're on, Jews get hate.

yes for totally no reason at all - I mean oyy veyy - am I right guys.

Even the Jews are out to get the Jews.

VIP, very important post

ass

This is why I'm a centrist. Everyone else is too clouded by hate and fear to actually function as a human

this

If you're not clouded by fear and hate, how can you even call yourself human?

This is lecture they reference

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTiRnbNT5uE

Pinker is 100% right.

The most controversial thing he said was around the 5 minute mark when he claims “classical” (whatever the fuck that means) Islamdom had no equivalent to Christiandom’s inquisitions or wars of religion. Muhammad on matzah, that man needs to actually read a book about Islam.

Pinker: Here are uncontroversial and true statements in the real world, why they radicalize people who don't get exposed to them in a reasonable way, and strong counterarguments.

PZ Myers, leftist Twitter: REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

It's particularly funny that the skeptic community doesn't realize that this is history repeating itself. Something like 20 years ago, Fox ran an hour long "documentary" on Apollo Hoax claims. It was hosted by that guy from Star Trek. Anyway, like most people, I was aware that there this conspiracy theory existed, but the only exposure I'd ever had to it was, "lol some people think Apollo was a hoax, how retarded they are! lol!!"

So then Fox airs this documentary, and it puts forth the hoax claims. I had never heard any of them before, and I had no response to any of them.

The skeptic community owes its very existence in part to the reaction to that documentary. A lot of people - seriously, a lot - became apollo conspiracy nuts because of it. It took a while (like years) for the other side to organize and start addressing the claims. The "bad astronomy" guy got his start in the aftermath - he got into the skeptic community by debating conspiracy theorists about apollo.

It's exactly the same phenomenon that Pinker is describing: people have never been confronted by an idea except in a "safe space" where they ridicule it instead of addressing it. What this results in are people who are susceptible to being convinced by the idea the first time they hear it fully articulated. 20 years ago, there was a surge in apollo hoax believers because Fox articulated the conspiracy theories, and viewers weren't able to counter them. Today, the same thing happens when the alt right gets a meme out there.

The end result is that now we have a lot of moon landing deniers, plus a lot of 'skeptics' patting each other on the back for how smart they supposedly are for knowing that planets are round. Exposure to bad ideas doesn't help commoners at all. The masses aren't able to counter alt-right memes because they are too unsophisticated to have political beliefs that go beyond the most recent meme they've been exposed to, and there is no hypothetical anti-alt-right skeptics movement that is going to change that.

there is no hypothetical anti-alt-right skeptics movement that is going to change that.

If a patient and calm group of people were to form to counter the alt-right, I have no doubts they would have an effect. Far as I know, there's nothing like that, only groups of people who shout "Nazi" at everyone who doesn't think that toxic masculinity in bullriding is a problem that requires a congressional hearing.

Plenty of these people exist. You just don't know about them because poors won't pay attention to anyone who isn't hooting and hollering like a Jerry Springer audience.

Plenty of these people exist.

Wheres the Richard Dawkins/Michael Shermer/Sam Harris/Dan Dennett of the anti alt-right? Near as I can tell the only one I know of is the article's subject, the Jew with the Jew fro who now I'm told hates Jews.

PZ Myers

Well that's a name I haven't heard in a while...

It's good to know that he's learned absolutely nothing over time. I'd probably be a feminist today if his website wasn't full-on "it's not our job to educate you." I'm sure the same strategy will work just as well with the alt right.

knock on fucking wood. that guy is one of the most insufferable fucks on the face of this earth, right up there next to Wil Wheaton and that guy who comes over for a big party and jacks off in the bathroom with the door unlocked

Why'd you mention /u/wil twice?

at least i didn't ping him, since i figured his tender soy bones wouldn't stand up to the bantz

Pinker's right, but he doesn't go far enough. The problem with echo chambers and shibboleth culture in the liberal establishment isn't just that it's a bad strategy for dealing with people outside the tribe, it's that it breeds lazy, weak thinking within the tribe. The mind needs to be exercised and strengthened just like any other muscle, and debate and argument can reveal flaws and fallacies within even well-established positions and stances. When you socially coerce your people not to argue and debate within the party line, you remove the ability to stop bad ideas and erroneous conclusions from spreading and taking root, and that just makes it even harder to convince people in the middle to take your side.

TFW American political culture is turning me into a cybernetic futurist. Humans can't be trusted with feelings.

Bro, stop trying to spin this on "the left."

There is no arguing with American conservatives, they're literally some of the most retarded people on the planet.

Maybe not retarded - but willfully ignorant. We're talking about a demographic that straight up thinks science is a liberal conspiracy, experts are always wrong, and their opinions are on equal footing with empirical research.

And everything you just listed here exists on the right, on an even greater level.

Here's the thing about those "bad ideas" and why they're hard to stop, even with reasoned debate. Because the bad ideas these people express appeal to people on a primal level, and the people they appeal to make up a majority of the country.

Do you think a white nationalist is a white nationalist because he cares what the facts say?

Come on, Pizza, you're smarter than this. By criticizing liberal culture, I am In no way implying that American conservatism is somehow more rational or virtuous than liberalism is - far from it. But, speaking as a leftist, if left-of-center politics is going to have a future in this country, we've have got to be able to make a case to people who don't already agree with us, and the discursive trend in left-liberal culture - the unwillingness to engage with opponents as equals, the instinct to see any disagreement as evidence of maliciousness or bad faith, the inability to consider people as individuals rather than as a collection of identity brackets - all this is hamstringing our ability to organize and articulate a counterargument to the reactionary mess on the right. It's never been more crucial for liberals to have their shit together, but their shit is falling apart.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I don't have any good ideas for how to fix any of this. I'd like to believe that the left can save liberalism by reorienting it around material issues like inequality and social programs, but left-wing activists seem to think that they need to be even more obnoxiously obsessed with name-calling and circlejerking than liberals. It's high-school level pettiness and it makes it difficult for me to take anybody seriously, frankly, even when they're technically my allies.

Nice whataboutism.

Do you even know what the word whataboutism means or is it just a buzzterm you throw out because you have the intellectual capacity of a child?

Because I've got news for you retard, nothing in that comment could possibly meet the definition of "whataboutism."

And to prove that you don't know whataboutism is, I'll ask this:

In your own words, explain the difference between fallacious and non-fallacious "whataboutism."

you have the intellectual capacity of a child?

Oh noes! I've been had.

fallacious "whataboutism."

Bring up statistic of Black-on-Black crime when someone else is talking about Police brutality.

non-fallacious "whataboutism."

Calling out that Christianity has done something worse when we discuss Muslim terrorism.

Bring up statistic of Black-on-Black crime when someone else is talking about Police brutality.

Absolutely false.

Calling out that Christianity has done something worse when we discuss Muslim terrorism.

That'd be fallacious whataboutism, actually.

Whataboutism would be me "deflecting" or saying "it's ok the left does it because the right does it."

Not the whataboutism I've heard

It is not merely the changing of a subject... it’s essentially a reversal of accusation, arguing that an opponent is guilty of an offense just as egregious or worse than what the original party was accused of doing, however unconnected the offenses may be.

What you did was saying "The Right was worse" when someone is criticizing the Left of its echo chamber problems.

Of course we know the Right has echo chamber problems. We've been brought up knowing how dumb and how anti-intellectual they are for the past 10 years at least.

Not the whataboutism I've heard

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

The term comes from soviet tactics dude.

Whataboutism (also known as whataboutery) is a variant of the tu quoque logical fallacy that attempts to discredit an opponent's position by charging them with hypocrisy without directly refuting or disproving their argument,[1][2][3] which is particularly associated with Soviet and Russian propaganda.[4][5][6] When criticisms were leveled at the Soviet Union, the Soviet response would be "What about..." followed by an event in the Western world.[7][8][9]

Whataboutism

Whataboutism (also known as whataboutery) is a variant of the tu quoque logical fallacy that attempts to discredit an opponent's position by charging them with hypocrisy without directly refuting or disproving their argument, which is particularly associated with Soviet and Russian propaganda. When criticisms were leveled at the Soviet Union, the Soviet response would be "What about..." followed by an event in the Western world.

The term "whataboutery" has been used in Britain and Ireland since the period of the Troubles (conflict) in Northern Ireland. Lexicographers date the first appearance of the variant whataboutism to the 1990s, while other historians state that during the Cold War Western officials referred to the Soviet propaganda strategy by that term.


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Whataboutism... is a variant of the tu quoque logical fallacy that attempts to discredit an opponent's position by charging them with hypocrisy without directly refuting or disproving their argument

That is on the page you linked.

Yet you never really see anyone talk about how the "right-wing echo chamber" lost them elections.

I thought the media blasted that idea during the Obama Administration. You know, how White men are a dying breed. How they are only preaching to their own, and cannot reach out beyond to the diverse world of Blacks and Browns. I got so sick of hearing it for 8 years and even during the election season, that Dems would just make up the lost White vote with non-White votes.

That is on the page you linked.

Yes, and nothing I said falls under that definition.

I thought the media blasted that idea during the Obama Administration. You know, how White men are a dying breed. How they are only preaching to their own, and cannot reach out beyond to the diverse world of Blacks and Browns. I got so sick of hearing it for 8 years and even during the election season, that Dems would just make up the lost White vote with non-White votes.

And here's my point - the right is the biggest echo chamber in the country. The GOP is far less diverse than the DNC is. This alone is why the left will NEVER be as big an echo chamber as the right, not even close.

There's far less ideological purity on the left than on the right. At some point those angry white guys will be erased, you can only coast on racial anxiety for so long.

Yes, and nothing I said falls under that definition.

What you have been doing in this thread is to pop up screeching at them when they criticize the left for being dumb by saying the right is dumber. I think that fits the definition in the page you've linked pretty well.

It doesn't. The person I responded to was very clearly implying this was mainly a "left-wing problem."

The problem with echo chambers and shibboleth culture in the liberal establishment

Doesn't look like the person is saying only the Left does it. This is his clarification of your comment:

By criticizing liberal culture, I am In no way implying that American conservatism is somehow more rational or virtuous than liberalism is - far from it.

I didn't say your argument is invalid, it just sounds stupid.

Hence transgenderism

(((Jewish)))

(The echos mean white now)

Not surprised - Steven Pinker is both brilliant and not afraid to buck whatever people want to claim are "accepted norms" when putting forth his theories. Which of course, totally makes him a Nazi these days.

Breaking news: liberal pearl clutches are freaking retards. More at 11.

Did you even read the article in which the right-tards ran around claiming this guy endorsed them and said they were right?