r/drama: Zizek vs. Peterson ''''Debate''''''' Thread

There's an old episode of I'm with Busey where Gary Busey goes hiking with a UFO enthusiast and a Bigfoot enthusiast, and they get into a fistfight (neither one of them knew how to fight) over whether Bigfoot or aliens were more real.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

link?

1 soupvsjonez 2019-04-20

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrGPKfvX_QI

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

sweet thanks!

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

Itd be more fun to get drunk with them after the debate.

1 Starship_Litterbox_C 2019-04-20

Only in an extremely sleazy strip joint, with a big box of whip its and a bottle of cheap scotch in my inner coat pocket

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

excellent taste

1 hotwifesnearyou 2019-04-20

Should've just pregamed for the debate smh. This is the perfect kind of thing to watch on a nice, comfy dose of (3-meo-)PCP.

1 ebolaRETURNS 2019-04-20

https://i.kymcdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/022/506/manofculture.JPG

1 ebolaRETURNS 2019-04-20

Cards on the table, I have 3-oh-pce to work with instead.

Can't really sit through Peterson's schlock...won't be learning anything new about Marxist theory from someone who just read the Communist Manifesto once, and bizarrely poorly (particularly because Zizek is reading Hegel and the young, humanist Marx into Marx's later work). But Zizek is essentially an incoherent madman with occasional insight and a number of missteps. So I can take that in little doses. . .

1 WiggityWatchinNews 2019-04-20

The sound quality is so bad I'm getting maybe a tenth of what he says between the phlegm

1 give_me_my_keys 2019-04-20

I have no idea who this guy is but as misophoniacel I want to cut his head off.

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

Has JBP read anything not written by Jung, Solzhenitsyn, or Dostoyevsky?

1 aX10mAt1CaL1Y 2019-04-20

He probably hasn’t even read more than the basics by those guys either.

1 BestGetOutOfMoyWay 2019-04-20

Nietzche

1 mukumukum68-28 2019-04-20

This is, err, precisely the point sniff.

1 Denny_Craine 2019-04-20

I have serious doubts he's actually read Nietzche

1 ItsGettinBetterMan 2019-04-20

Aren't his points sort of in line with Nietzche though? Transfiguration of morals seems to a big point for him, not a carbon copy of Nietzche but definitely influenced.

1 Denny_Craine 2019-04-20

Dude Peterson's whole spiel is this appeal to tradition and the necessity of a Christian moral foundation for the preservation of society. Nietzsche despised that shit

1 ItsGettinBetterMan 2019-04-20

I said his points on people having to find something higher to look for and aspire too instead of being depressed weirdos on the internet is much like Nietzche transfiguration of values.

1 Denny_Craine 2019-04-20

*Transvaluation. Transfiguration is a class at Hogwarts

And not really. Since Nietzsches whole thing about transvlauation of values was that we should take the dominant judeo-christian morality and flip it into the opposite. It's literally what Peterson gets pee-his-panties scared about

1 homelandsecurity__ 2019-04-20

Transfiguration is a class at Hogwarts

While that's true, transfiguration/transfigure is also a real word. It seems like it's usually used in a religious context but not always.

"to change in outward form or appearance; transform.

to change so as to glorify or exalt."

(From dictionary.com)

1 BestGetOutOfMoyWay 2019-04-20

Which book by Nietzche do you think he has not read?

1 Denny_Craine 2019-04-20

The Gay Science

1 AlveolarPressure 2019-04-20

How does he have fans? I've never listened to him talk before but he is completely incoherent.

1 Woolgun 2019-04-20

IDK he probably appeals to right wing incels with super basic shit so they like him. Also he's bad live/thinking on his feet from what I gathered.

1 AlveolarPressure 2019-04-20

He clearly had prepared remarks though. He was reading something off his laptop. Maybe he's super nervous or something but it wasn't a good look.

Also does zizek always have that lisp (not the accent but him sounding like he's constantly choking on spit)? This debate is a shitshow where both people are actively painful to listen to.

1 McFluffTheCrimeCat 2019-04-20

He was reading something off his laptop

What? Like a notecard I get it when you’ve got to pull out a laptop 😐

1 trappysaruh 2019-04-20

Also does zizek always have that lisp

yes, he's famous for it

1 Ravensthrowit 2019-04-20

The only time anyone should take Slavoj Zizek seriously

He makes some good points tbh

1 THOT-AUDITOR 2019-04-20

In my experience a shitload of Peterson's fans are dudes mildly on the spectrum who take his jungian psychobabble metaphors 100% literally and like it for the same reasons they obsess over capeshit.

1 lenovolegion 2019-04-20

I dont understand much of it but I've come across some of his works on psychology that were highly acclaimed like from a couple of decades back

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

Dawkins had some great publications in the 70's but that doesn't make his social commentary any less ridiculous. Academic scientists spend years to decades focusing on a tiny facet of a field. It doesn't speak to their ability to produce insights about anything beyond that, especially the further you get from the area of expertise. Unfortunately a vocal minority of academics who played the game well enough to get tenure are under the impression that their success in their area makes their unrelated opinions have equal value and spew their shit to unfortunate souls who understandably believe that expert in one thing = smart enough to speak with authority on other things

1 obsequium_ 2019-04-20

Look at this smelly leftist, so resentful someone is actually successful. Envy is really burning you up man it’s nooot a good look, yikes

1 lenovolegion 2019-04-20

Definitely, I agree with you, but I was just adding context to people who think he's just an ordinary psychologist turned yogi, like the comment which I replied to which said he spoke psychobabble which I doubt very much given his expertise in the field. But yes what you said is true that expertise doesnt translate to his social commentary

1 LedinToke 2019-04-20

I think he's interesting to listen to, but the people who obsess over him are fuckin goons

1 THOT-AUDITOR 2019-04-20

Agreed. His book was interesting enough and the bible podcasts can be interesting if you can get past the aforementioned psychobabble.

1 elwombat 2019-04-20

He was more coherent than sniffles.

1 VapeOnYourNape 2019-04-20

1 Karmawasforsuckers 2019-04-20

1 ubermanwolf 2019-04-20

1 Slack_Irritant 2019-04-20

1 fat_fist_fister 2019-04-20

I just like watching his UT lectures. They’re interesting, probably a pseudoscience, but still cool

1 BillyRayAtkins 2019-04-20

He has qualifications and agreed with the right wing about their bizarre interpretation of Canadian law. He's the first academic to actually agree with them on that front. Then people found his YouTube lectures where he tells people to wash their penis and clean their room and he got a taste for fame and started really catering to the incel fans.

Reminder Marie Kondo is the superior version of Jordan Peterson. She tells her fans how to clean their house while he tells them to clean their room. This is because her fans don't live with their parents.

1 PvtBrasilball 2019-04-20

never listened to him talk before

he is completely incoherent

????

1 AlveolarPressure 2019-04-20

Before this terrible debate I had never listened to JP. In the debate (which I did listen to part of) he was incoherent. Pls try to work it out in ur head beforehand.

1 PvtBrasilball 2019-04-20

Yeah, he wasnt being very clear. But sometimes Jordan is pretty easy to follow, specially in the interviews. Like the swedish one.

1 d-amazo 2019-04-20

So in the end both sides are gonna claim their favorite won.

so every debate ever.

1 BillyRayAtkins 2019-04-20

I honestly miss Dawkins. Say whatever you will about him but he had charisma and was entertaining. Peterson and Zizek are snoozefests.

1 agareo 2019-04-20

Dawkins, Hitchens, the lot. These guys are terrible in comparison

1 acidoverbasic 2019-04-20

Baked af and 💦💦💦

1 loli_esports 2019-04-20

Baked af as cummies?

1 razzmataz 2019-04-20

He’s Greek. They all sound like that.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

he's slovenian and seems to have an accent that suggests that he spent some time near the Italian border. i think he just has sinus issues, someone should make a wearable device for him that sucks all of the saliva out of his mouth like the thing that the dentist uses to clean things out so they can do work. that would be a huge improvement.

1 thebrokenbell 2019-04-20

Snally senpai, I always thought he’s snorting a pile of bad no no white power right before every interviews. (Watch a couple of his interviews)

Oh, I’m such a terrible person to assume he’s degen. 😞

LOVE YOU ALL!!! ❤️❤️❤️

1 razzmataz 2019-04-20

he could use the voice machine that smokers with throat cancer use to speak with.

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

Drinking game rules?

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

drink when someone says 'capitalism'
drink when someone says 'communism'
drink when someone says 'socialism'
drink when someone says 'capital'
drink when someone says 'labor'

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

Dont kill me, Snally.

1 TaysSecondGussy 2019-04-20

Child’s play. I dare you to drink every time Zizek says: “SNIFFF!”.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

Is sniffing really saying tho? 🤔

1 TaysSecondGussy 2019-04-20

When he does it, yeah. Idk why.

1 parallelbledsoe 2019-04-20

RIP

1 Starship_Litterbox_C 2019-04-20

Drink whenever Peterson stares at his waving hands while he talks

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

Drink whenever he says "bloody"

1 VapeOnYourNape 2019-04-20

post modern and ideology

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

good one

1 AlveolarPressure 2019-04-20

Buttchug a whole handle of vodka so you don't have to listen to the debate anymore

1 shaneoffline 2019-04-20

Anyone who's TRULY committed to drama should be getting drunk

I always knew you understood me snalgal

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

🍻

1 Coonass_alt 2019-04-20

I’m getting drunk and going out does that count.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

You made the right decision, this is a total waste of time, just utterly boring

1 Coonass_alt 2019-04-20

Hell yeah.

1 give_me_my_keys 2019-04-20

Lol I'll just have a few I'm sure nothing bad will happ-

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_alcohol_spectrum_disorder

1 necrocannibal2 2019-04-20

why is Peterson's voice always shaking? what is he so afraid of? maybe a fat slovene bull about to fuck his whole ideology?

1 ObsessedAussie 2019-04-20

https://images.app.goo.gl/ns3WtjKp729isEz7A

1 ObsessedAussie 2019-04-20

https://i.imgur.com/ZStmn9j.gif

1 mukumukum68-28 2019-04-20

This is, err, precisely the point sniff.

1 homelandsecurity__ 2019-04-20

Are these the cultural marxists taking over the world?

1 BeiberFan123 2019-04-20

Never understood how anyone sees value in a college campus being worth defending so much. Like, 90% of them are pretty insignificant.

1 VapeOnYourNape 2019-04-20

day of the boil

1 BornIn1142 2019-04-20

He had a sip of cider.

1 necrocannibal2 2019-04-20

for those were bored of Peterson, the sniffing blob is the one talking right now

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

he doesn't seem to has sniffed yet but he's spitting all over the stage

1 GandalftheChromatic 2019-04-20

Anybody else jerking off instead of watching this?

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

Practice semen retention and walk with christ.

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

Instead? No. During?

1 WiggityWatchinNews 2019-04-20

Between Peterson's palpable fear and Zizek squirting all over the stage, I've come maybe 30 or so times since that Mark Rubin clone walked on stage. I think my dick is starting to bleed but I don't have time to check

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

Bloody crotch stumps await us. Which one of Zizek's 27 tics do you finish to?

1 WiggityWatchinNews 2019-04-20

Just one? Oh you sweat child

1 heretobefriends 2019-04-20

He's going for the lobsters

1 [deleted] 2019-04-20

[removed]

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

😒

1 McFluffTheCrimeCat 2019-04-20

Oh no. Someone’s probably bought this stuff.

1 VidiotGamer 2019-04-20

GET YOUR MERCH

Considering this was basically a capitalism vs. socialism debate, doesn't this mean that Peterson won?

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

This is horrible. I want to die.

1 WiggityWatchinNews 2019-04-20

Have you tried cleaning your room

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

No. Maybe it's finally time.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

same...turning this on was a horrible mistake.

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

This is our Friday night. What has become of us?

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

we're getting old and boring, Nom.

1 Nom_Chompy 2019-04-20

I'm already old and boring tho. This is worse somehow.

1 darth_stroyer 2019-04-20

Lobster father seems like he's on the verge of tears.

1 VapeOnYourNape 2019-04-20

he's on a raw beef diet and I think the parasites are messing with his brain

1 SNCommand 2019-04-20

This is boring, you've got a self hating marxist and a timid capitalist refusing to take any solid stance on anything They should have added a self described fascist just to turn it into a free for all

1 WiggityWatchinNews 2019-04-20

Eh the beginning was weak because the topic of debate was so ill-defined and it felt like they were just talking past each other but now that they're just talking back and forth it feels much more productive. It feels more like a discussion instead of a debate, so that's pretty lame

1 lenovolegion 2019-04-20

Zizek vs ben stiller when

1 RollBread 2019-04-20

Kermit and Spitler need some public speaking courses, what a boring, rambling pile.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

Spitler is the Richard Stallman of philosophy
Kermit can't make a point without referencing himself
Spitler reminds me of a sick cat
Kermit formed his belief system by seeing crazy commies and crazy progressives online and fusing commie and progressive ideology together
Neither Kermit nor Spitler know how to directly engage with other arguments in real-time
Neither Kermit nor Spitler are worth listening to

1 ChaimWeizmann 2019-04-20

Kermit is really dumb like I honestly have to doubt his credentials after watching his debate. I am functionally imbecile as far as philosophy is concerned but even I get the basics he has no idea about.

1 uniqueguy263 2019-04-20

The debate sounded like the arguments diacordcels have that get posted to the sub

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

It was barely even an argument; they just said what they wanted to say and hardly tried to dismantle what the other was saying. It two hours of complete navel-gazing. Even some discord arguments are more interesting

1 Heisenberg_007 2019-04-20

Neither Kermit nor Spitler are worth listening to

Then who are?

1 Momruepari 2019-04-20

Anyone who's TRULY committed to drama should be getting drunk and ~~watching this shitshow unfold~~ throwing household objects at their SO

1 DistortedLines 2019-04-20

Zizek's closer about the individual vs bigger system dichotomy was fantastic. Peterson got cucked by Zizek and licked the cum of the sheets.

1 SgtViktorReznov 2019-04-20

P R A I S E

Commie Hobo Daddy does it again

1 elwombat 2019-04-20

They agreed with eachother more than they disagreed. So they both win and so does centrism!

1 FlipOff11 2019-04-20

ALOT of people on reddit are smarter than these two fags. I know this because I read it every time Peterson or Zizek come up. Reddit are most brainiest peoples.

1 DonElad1o 2019-04-20

Yeah, I bet those two f-slurs don’t know who furr1es are. Ignorant sons of b-slurs

1 cmakk1012 2019-04-20

So I just read this thread instead of actually watching any of it, is it safe to say Zizek “won” but that the whole thing was a pathetic joke?

1 westofthetracks 2019-04-20

as if there was any other possible outcome

1 currentyearplusx 2019-04-20

He won in that he knew more about Marxism than Peterson, but he also pretty much agreed that capitalism was the superior system by the beginning of the debate. So it’s really up to whatever your political leaning is.

1 HeyHoneyHey 2019-04-20

He’s a Marxists and he said capitalism was better?

1 currentyearplusx 2019-04-20

He admitted that it was a successful system that had brought billions out of poverty

1 ohno911 2019-04-20

Not what he said. He agreed that the communist manifesto has certain faults and pointed out notable flaws in capitalism. To be honest, if you want to know what he says, maybe just watch the debate. It is always better to trust the direct source if you want to learn something new.

1 HeyHoneyHey 2019-04-20

🤢 🤮 Waste time and money watching a pointless debate 🤢 🤮

1 ohno911 2019-04-20

'Pointless' is a matter of perception. Also... Youtube is free...

1 werewolf_bar_mitzva 2019-04-20

What did you drink while watching this, Snally? I partook of a delicate summer mead. Then I huffed some glue because this shit fucking sucked and I wanted to forget it's existence.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

What did you drink while watching this, Snally?

A few generic IPAs, a Heineken tallboy and some shots of Espolon

I partook of a delicate summer mead.

Nice, did you make it yourself?

Then I huffed some glue because this shit fucking sucked and I wanted to forget it's existence.

Nice, did you make it yourself?

1 werewolf_bar_mitzva 2019-04-20

Heineken

It's over for Artoiscels, I guess, but Heineken is gross. I hope you drank that shit in the order you listed it so you didn't really taste the Dutch piss.

1 SandorClegane_AMA 2019-04-20

Watch it? You mean to give money to:

- a man with a mouth full of saliva talking about propaganda in Western society for an hour who is still a commie?
- a man who likely thinks the society in a Handmaid's Tale is a utopia?

Naw Dawg.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

There were a few free streams

1 e-guy 2019-04-20

God Peterson fellated Zizek so fucking hard, I thought they'd finish the debate by pulling out some progressive protestant priest and get married.

Is it even really a debate if you're just bowing and scraping to your opponent most of the time because he uses the simplest rhetorical trick in the book by ending everything with "do you agree?"

This just solidifies in my mind the dominance of Zizek over Peterson, and that Peterson is 100% the bottom bitch.

1 snallygaster 2019-04-20

Zizek was extremely disappointing too though; there were numerous points where he could have completely dismissed Peterson's arguments and he hardly put forth any of his own. Some people are saying that Zizek went soft on Peterson in order to win over some of his supporters but the whole thing came off as dishonest and neither guy came off as if they were generally worth listening to. It's a real shame that they're the two biggest academic figures atm but i guess it's better than Derrida and shit

1 Woolgun 2019-04-20

I think Zizek was just careful and didn't want to give Peterson much to attack - he denounced idpol and past attempts at implementing socialism himself, among other things, so JP was kinda left with nothing to criticize. When he saw JP is out of his depth he started attacking him more, like when he asked him to name 1 "post modern neo marxist".

But I agree that he didn't really have many arguments on his own, but that's pretty much what leftism is. They point out the flaws in capitalism, sometimes correctly, sometimes they incorrectly, but cannot line out even basics of a system it'd be replaced by. Zizek probably knew he can't do this because Peterson would have something to criticize, so he left him with nothing.

In the end, it was Zizek vs Peterson, and Zizek won, instead of Capitalism vs Marxist, because they've just agreed capitalism is flawed and we have no coherent ideology to replace it with.

1 martini29 2019-04-20

because they've just agreed capitalism is flawed and we have no coherent ideology to replace it with.

Idk m8 that sounds pretty accurate to me though

1 Woolgun 2019-04-20

Never said it was wrong, just that when it comes to political systems, neither Marxism (or leftism) nor capitalism were "winners" in this debate.

Capitalism's issues couldn't be defended but no real alternative was presented, so as far as I'm aware leftism is still a meme ideology just like Libertarianism or AnCapism, the difference is leftists have a point when criticizing current system.

1 ClaireBear1123 2019-04-20

Zizek needs to go on twitter

1 econ_throwaways 2019-04-20

So Fukuyama was the real winner all along!

1 -Mopsus- 2019-04-20

God Peterson fellated Zizek so fucking hard, I thought they'd finish the debate by saying that they had no differences, were soulmates, and were getting gay married.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPaiyJGTko0

1 JustLions 2019-04-20

This is so fucking boring that I gave up reading these comments after half a minute, let alone watch the debate.

This is just like how hard it is to stay awake in Professor Binns' class at Hogwarts. Snooooooozers. 😴

1 spergling_ 2019-04-20

If any of you fuckheads spend friday evenig watching this shit instead - have sex

1 SgtViktorReznov 2019-04-20

FUCK

I was too busy enjoying a night out for my sisters birthday to watch it!!

I trust Zizek mopped the floor with that emaciated self-help peddler?

1 gardar15 2019-04-20

Post sister pics

1 ObnoxiousFactczecher 2019-04-20

Uh. I can barely stand one of those guys, and you suggest I should watch both of them at once? You monster!

1 MacauHighRoller 2019-04-20

Oh man watching all the braindead wastes of space in /r/JordanPeterson and /r/ChapoTrapHouse sperg the fuck out at this last night was hilarious, acting like either of these morons are relevant and that the debate wasn't fucking pointless

What kind of absolute dumbasses care about this garbage

1 ceremona 2019-04-20

I liked her take on the debate. https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=ARQcvdtSdQs