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Fix the link if u can

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Couldn't but posted better links in the comment

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Excellent

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Youve read all of moore right? How much does this article apply to him:

https://samkriss.substack.com/p/the-repulsive-crust

It seems in the Watchmen days his characters were less explicable then with League he really started to double down on the pop psychology

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I know. Characters got much less grey. There were heroes and there were villains. Why did Jimmy betray England? Why didn't he share the wonderful fountain of immortality with all of England and thus make himself the greatest Englishman to ever live? What motivated Jimmy? It's crude pop-psychology. Also he wants to talk about modern pop-culture and superheroes but he really doesn't have anything interesting to say about it. The world becomes flatter and less interesting as the volumes go on.

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I was thinking that with his characters and I havent read ANY Moore but I know Bond and I know Bond is a misogynist and everything but Moore seems to run on a belief that the characters if "realistic" would all have the same end point and I dont believe that

Bond IS a misogynist and a bigot but he's also aware of that and constantly introspective on it and trying to manage it. He's also aware that Britain sucks but it's just inherent in his blood and from all his experiences to go down with his country. They discuss this in the YOLT book, he's aware England sucks but he hates every other country too much to betray or even give credit to anyone else

The same thing with Harry Potter, so The Moonchild who canonically had an abusive childhood would suddenly become evil because he learned his friends were fake? So all of his morals go out the window because one bad thing happened to him? Sure, people do bad things sometimes on a whim but this is established as like a moment his entire character hinged on. That he would give up rather than find a way to fight his supposed own nature, the guy even if groomed even if all his friends were fake has still been molded into the kind of human being who wouldnt do this

And I think that's a fundamental flaw of his philosophy: people are not their intrusive thoughts. There are some people, most people, who are simply made of sterner stuff than that. Most soldiers dont have PTSD, most murderers dont have any mental illnesses, the phrase "potentially traumatic experience" is the default way of referring to these kind of tragic events for a reason. Fictional characters especially are inherently also going to be more resistant to drug addiction, grief, stress, death, because they tend to occupy positions that imbue them with stronger psychology. It's inherently more interesting to follow these people because of their resistances, but even then most human beings dont even get influenced by psychology as much as is stereotyped

It's a fundamental misunderstanding of human beings. Alan Moore is a complicated guy when it comes to superheroes because they are his biggest influence, but he seems to misunderstand why Stan Lee for example wrote "two dimensional characters". Because psychological realism doesn't mean anyone will actually relate to your characters. I've known Aunt Mays, Flash Thompsons and Mary Janes. I've never met a Comedian. People aren't merely feelings, there's an element of mind, matter and spirituality as well as The Unknown that influences people. Sometimes what you see really is what you get. People have different fundamental limits. I'm never going to like Dark Chocolate no matter how immortal I become, but Moore seems to believe if you live long enough or have enough psychic powers you're not only going to eventually like Dark Chocolate but eventually you're going to do a backflip and deglove your wife because power corrupts man! But there are many people in power, absolute power, who didn't do that like the guy who could've started WW3 back during the Cold War if he reported a missile as from America but he chose to wait

It's this weird thing because making realistic and complicated morality doesn't work when it's a world where people can fly. For one, realistic and complicated morality doesn't really matter when people dont apply morality in a day to day basis. For two, realistic morality is subjective when coming from human beings with their own quibbles like a high school dropout who thinks comic writers can just strike to solve all their problems. For three, the lessons about morality don't really ring inherently as soon as you import them into sci-fi fantasy settings. To Kill a Mockingbird would be less potent as a story if it had aliens, but the lessons about morality in his books are purely hypothetical because they rely on this idea of "what if we had absolute power?" well we don't. That's why the lessons in literary fiction are just better

But then the deconstruction stops as soon as it gets to something he likes. The golliwog can't be portrayed as a black person or have anyone react to him as he is: a blackface minstrel stereotype. Instead he has to concoct this bizarre idea of him as an alien (but still a slave because he keeps it classy). Orlando, from what I read, only had occasional bouts of violence because he's lived so long man! As opposed to Quartermain who was practically catatonic with his drug addiction. Orlando's vices are compressed and they are only there because like living forever would be stressful man! Again, ignoring any sort of matter or soul implications of Orlando's abilities and focusing purely on the psychological. But even then I can think of many ways to deconstruct Orlando, for example having Orlando experience a ton of bigotry to the point of not wanting to go out into the world when living as a woman. Or having Orlando get gender dysphoria as a man, trying to trans out his male persona and then when switching to a woman getting gender dysphoria AGAIN and wanting to go back to being a man. Or even just having the knowledge of being able to understand both sexes but knowing no one else on either side can just making Orlando super depressed and jaded

That's me doing his thing of just stuffing characters full of neurosis but you can see the problem right? The worst case scenario is saved for characters he can get off on making look like fools but then his pet loves get very downplayed flaws or flaws that aren't even flaws like "I have too much le s*x and smoke too much le weed" which again he doesnt really question the downsides of free love or drug use beyond addiction whereas those things are usually the lead cause of r*pe (the real kind, not the cartoony bend you over in an alleyway kind he puts in all his books)

I get he's a smart guy, probably smarter than the both of us because our mental illnesses or hang ups mean there are elements we just dont understand about him that he does about himself or even guys like us, but the parts where he is wrong come off as so arrogant. he can say it's a persona when he tries to psychoanalyze people who dislike him but when he's actively trying to slander a guy like Morrison as a plagiarist and misrepresenting arguments and stats back to back with that in order to accuse a guy who's calling out the golliwog of simply doing so because he likes Batman you're maybe not some 4D chessmaster philosopher troll and in some cases just an r-slur (which his daughter has seemingly confirmed on twitter, with her bringing up that he still talks about and watches capeshit with her and her kids but is just extremely bitter about the economics stuff behind the scenes. I recommend looking it up she seems to take it super seriously)

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He's a good writer but not a great one. His problem is that he got too used to being the smartest person in the room.

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which is the consequence of choosing a midwit occupation like comic book writer. as soon as you bring up hemingway he suddenly becomes a lil capeshitter

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Probably because Hemingway is stylistically uninteresting. His prose is deliberately simple. This in anathema to Moore.

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sometimes the dryness is the draw

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What?

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https://www.tumblr.com/gailsimone/16872360753/someone-asked Ill go to bat for moore and say that gail simone calling watchmen problematic is r-slurred

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The Golliwog could have worked as a hero in the same sense Allan Quatermain did, in that you acknowledge his flaws and how awful he was but still embrace him as a hero. The Golliwog is not this. He gave him a giant peepee and had him frick the dutch dolls. He had him talk like a minstrel character on whatever drugs Lewis Carrol was taking. He made him an escaped slave. He just kept piling on racist bits. He's a space alien made out of dark matter. He's oppressed by small-town sheriffs who are just racist against him. It's nauseating.

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All if that sounds really black, holy shit

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It's like how that shitty Velma series made Shaggy a racist stereotype by making him a black guy. Suddenly, everything about Shaggy is offensive because you chose to make him a black guy. I'm not normally a cuck who gets offended by this shit, but I'll whine about it when the story doesn't work.

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I loved Velma because it was the freshest take on Scooby Doo in decades.

Oh no those characters you love so much are shitty people now

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But its so boring. Velma as a southeast asian man discovers that everyone loves southeast asian manlets instead of discovering that everyone hates southeast asian manlets and thinks they're subhuman.

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It wasn't boring for me.

I'm not going to stop watching something on my own just because other people find it boring

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I unironically think velma works as satire

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At a lot of points it obviously is satire, just so on the nose it doesn't appear like it is

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this is r-slurred. The golliwog probably went to Moore directly in a seance or something and told him to put him in the comic. Who is Moore to tell a black man "no"?

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It's too bad, theyre really cute and I wouldn't mind collecting a few if they werent considered racist

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Someone should just color them green

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I am being serious: none of you are intelligent enough to understand why you're stupid. Usually I'm memeing or injecting a little bit of irony for fun but there is no irony here. All of you, with one or two exceptions, have little more than a thimbleful of political credibility and it stems from your complete inability to think through or research your points beyond coming to a conclusion spoon-fed to you by the culture around you since birth. None of you have the intellectual capacity to question the world around you and at least half of you don't even have the potential to develop it.

Snapshots:

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