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Male-to-Locomotives discuss fellow trains acting like caricatures of women

https://old.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/unxzrz/tw_overlyperformative_femininity?sort=controversial

That said, when I see trans women dressed excessively girly, inappropriately or almost in a costume (school girl outfits, Princess dresses, etc. etc.) I have trouble relating. It feels like this is enforcing negative trans stereotypes, and harming us as a group.

Logically, I know what other people do is unlikely to affect me, and my reaction is probably due to some remaining transphobia. Just a bunch of girls and women living their best lives and doing the things they always wanted to do but couldn't. I just have trouble squaring this away with my own feelings.


No hate on those enjoying themselves, I really am tempted to chalk this up firmly as a 'me' problem.


The TL:DR is that yes, it's a me problem. Trans women are beautiful and unique, it's our business what we wear, and haters are gonna hate anyway so I need to get over myself. And I promise I'm working on it.

OP trying so hard not to offend the hugbox, wonder what the commenters have to say:

I'm in my early 30s and dress like the goth girl I wanted to be when I was like 14. Frick the haters.

so brave!

Transwomen are just women. Cis women will dress up in girly outfits and school girl outfits to feel sexy, transwomen will do the same thing for the same reason. There's no difference between the two.

none whatsoever I'm sure, might as well drop the cis/trans labels

Also trans women often never had the chance to wear silly/princess outfits when they were younger unlike most cis women, so it's only fair they get to experience them while they have the chance, especially if it's something they've always wanted to wear Also I don't know if this is true, but trans girls going thru their second puberty because of HRT probably means sometimes they'll just act younger since they're experiencing their true adolescence for the first time, even if they're a few years older

hormones make you young again!

On your first point, I’ve been struggling with this so hard the last week or so. I just think of all the stuff I missed out on growing up. I can never get it back, and if I try people will see me like OP. Some over performative old dude trying to be girly. I’m not upset about the post or at OP, but I think you hit that head on.

learning to accept that you can't get your childhood back and moving on? nah, wear the outfit xueen

This is why trans only spaces online are so important. We need to be able to play in that space and gas each other up without taking shit from cis buttholes.

need safe spaces without c*s chuds telling us we're being "creepy" or "inappropriate"

Trans women not transwomen. Trans is just an adjective. You said cis women and not ciswomen, you should do the same for us.

It's a bit of a terf dog whistle implying that trans women are somehow a different type of woman.

It's clear this wasn't your intention, I just wanted to bring it to your attention, especially because of the difference in referring to trans and cis women in your comment.

:marseyconfused:

That is a good point, thank you for sharing. In the privacy of a trans sub, what's the harm?

I think my issue is when I see this out and about, it isn't what I'd expect cis women to do. Of course, I've probably passed a hundred trans women without realising before I see one person like that... and again, it's really not any of my business. But I worry that when I dress feminine it'll just be seen as a costume.

op is noticing things

Don't fall into the trap of worrying about how the actions of others may affect the perception of the community as a whole. People know that stereotypes are bullshit.

This "performative hyper-femininity" is often used as a way to work through trauma from not growing up as their true gender. Its a way to make up for things they missed out on.

it's just trauma, chud!

I am a cis partner to MTF and I think some of this is stuff I've wrestled with personally. Some of the things my partner worries about or talks about related to physical appearance are things that 13-14 year old me would have resonated with but mid-30s me finds annoying. I'm also in recovery from an eating disorder and have had to really work on "ignoring" the parts of my physical appearance I am not crazy about. It's hard to be supportive when I'm having those feelings but it helps to remember she a) won't be going through this part of transition forever and b) didn't get to do it the first time.

mids 30s, dressing 13-14, perfectly valid and normal!

Literally the best thing about three queer community is acceptance. Any queer who doesn't get that is doing it wrong

Respectability politics ("they make us look bad") is complete trash and is the biggest reason for marginalisation of trans people in queer spaces and in LGBT activism. At its worst, it is masc 4 masc white gay men disowning trans women of colour for "looking weird" after the trans women did all the hard work getting rights for them. It's selfish, it's ahistoric, and it's bigotry, pure and simple.

not wanting creepers to represent you is bigotry

also, many (cis and) trans women feel they have to overperform femininity to be treated as their gender.

cis women need to pass too

For many of us that's the only way to get gendered properly in public. If I wear anything short of high femme they look right at me and call me a man even when my appearance has plenty of indicators. When I dress high femme is pretty much the only time I get to feel beautiful.

:marseyl:

I get the sense that a lot didn’t have many female friends throughout their lives and that they mostly have their view of femininity from media.

So when it feels overly performative, that’s because it’s exactly that.

This is why I always very strongly think that people who want to be more feminine need to start by making and maintaining close meaningful relationships with cis women. Because that’s going to do more to develop unforced femininity than anything else will.

97
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this comic probably drove dozens of people to suicide

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One step at a time insha Allah

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These comics are hilarious but you just know it hit a little too close to home and derailed some trains

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derailed some trains

I sure hope so!

!blackjack105

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yuri anime

I wish that existed.

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Don't fall into the trap of worrying about how the actions of others may affect the perception of the community as a whole. People know that stereotypes are bullshit.

Yeah, it's also not an individuals responsibility to uphold the image of a group. Where would I be if I'd question my every action by how it will affect the image of all trans people, women, Europeans, humans and every other category I happen to be part of?

glad to see that trans folks have adopted the foid trait of refusing to take responsibility for your actions. in that sense they're truly women

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where would I be

In a much, much better place lol.

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Openly admitting they put themselves above literally everyone and everything to avoid even a minor inconvenience like having a independent thought

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Europeans

white person spotted

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coombrained train

Yeah no shit its a mayo

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also, many (cis and) trans women feel they have to overperform femininity to be treated as their gender.

cis women need to pass too

This is the funniest one to me., I've been with "queer" groups of people before and even the butchiest lesbo still looks like a foid.

simply delirious levels of cope here :marseychefkiss:

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I'm 6', often wear men's clothes, and still have never been mistaken as a man

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What's the weather like up there freak?

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Hmu

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:#marseynotes2:

one more rdrama foid eh...

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All cissies have a transdar

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There isn’t a single woman (male) that passes.

!blackjack105

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I literally went to a private school where everyone wore uniforms, and the girls wore the traditional school girl uniform of white blouse, plaid skirt, and tall socks. In the United States in the 21st century.

Just weird. That would be enough to have me move my daughter to a different school. That was never appropriate in the first place, and it raises the question of how exactly it ended up that way to begin with.

Wtf has this train ever been outside.

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What this porn addict doesn't realise is that actual school girl uniforms have skirt that go down to the knees and blouses that look professional, not the miniskirts and half-open bare-midriff shirts in the videos he jerks off to.

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I went to a private school, girls dressed like that and us fellas had to wear dorky blazers. no one, guy or girl looked sexy in those uniforms lol this laydee is just coombrained

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Not looking sexy is the literal fricking point of these uniforms at the middle and high school level.

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only at the middle and high school level

:#marseypedo:

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You normally don't have to worry about elementary school children dressing like sluts.

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Lmao literally thinks the fetish existed first. You can't make this up

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The valid :marseytrain: should never stop.

Being a bad caricature of a woman is the best

(and most dramatic) part about them

:#marseylove: :#marseytrans2:

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A huge, blinking button that say's "I'm a woman! Address me as ma'am!" with a recording that says the same over and over would be just as effective and ridiculous as the get-ups they wear.

https://i.rdrama.net/images/16841288892564087.webp

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Just trying to get this straight here. This guy -- a transphobe who hates performative :marseytrain2:ery -- has somehow been convinced to transition?

He's working through his transphobia with his therapist?

Hand up here who is this guy's therapist?

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it's an mtf who hates the worst "skirt go spinny uwu anime girl" types but because it's a hugbox that's "internalised transphobia" and a bad thing, not just common sense

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So he's just gunna transition into a frumpy cat lady. Probably end up more convincing than 99% of them.

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Just trying to get this straight here.

Problematic.

This guy -- a transphobe who hates performative :marseytrain2:ery -- has somehow been convinced to transition?

He's working through his transphobia with his therapist?

You have seen nothing yet. There's a LessWrong/SSC/TheMotte guy that goes by Saotome-Westlake and idk where he is now, but some years ago I had an argument with him about https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/11/21/the-categories-were-made-for-man-not-man-for-the-categories/ where he firmly insisted that no, trans women are not women, that's not how categories work, while (as I accidentally discovered because I'm a nosy b-word) being like six months in on heroic dosing of estrogen. Like still totally identifying as a man(male) who wants to grow tits because of gender dysphoria.

:#marseyautism:

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For onlookers who enjoy reading wordswordswords and aren't already familiar with him: http://unremediatedgender.space/ with best-of posts list on /about/

His overriding thesis seems to be that Blanchard's taxonomy and the existence of autogynephilia (AGP) ought to be publicly recognized for the good of the AGPs (not least the turbo-autists in his LessWrong rationalist in-group) so:

  1. they might avoid feeling compelled to :marseytrain2: out from a spergy obsession with logical consistency & their already weak identification with the masculine gender role,

  2. they don't contort their world-model into thinking that the "woman in a man's body" shtick is actually true in base reality, and

  3. the previous point being important for the fate of our future light cone, because he fears that when said friends create the 100ft-tall great AI god, they'll make it believe that transwomen are women, and this will lead to eternal heck on earth.

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Oh yeah, I forgot the "reparenting concept" where basically trains who are training, want to reexperience what its like being a kid or whatever but as their "correct" gender.

So these adults have to not only transition, but also regress mentally in order to re-experience their "missed childhood."

Making these the most mentally useless adults ever.

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That just sounds like extreme age play.

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there was a least a few examples on /r/itsafetish of these :marseytrain2:s who clearly were trying to live some teenage slumber party turned lesbian orgy fantasy like in their pornos.

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Also trans women often never had the chance to wear silly/princess outfits when they were younger unlike most cis women, so it's only fair they get to experience them while they have the chance, especially if it's something they've always wanted to wear Also I don't know if this is true, but trans girls going thru their second puberty because of HRT probably means sometimes they'll just act younger since they're experiencing their true adolescence for the first time, even if they're a few years older

That's the one that caught my eye, like, yeah, it's still cringey and should be socially unacceptable for 30 year old "women" to dress like 6-14 year olds.


The time has come for the Necromaster. The unleashing of the fourth joker's card. The arrival of The Great Milenko

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If I saw a non-trans person pretending to be a 5 year old in their free time i would be just as disgusted even if they "had a repressed childhood"

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Exactly. Men who have a mid life crisis and buy a muscle car or motorcycle get mocked as is, but imagine if they walking around in a police costume complete with plastic badge and handcuffs.


The time has come for the Necromaster. The unleashing of the fourth joker's card. The arrival of The Great Milenko

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it's not a fetish or a mental illness ok

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Can someone explain the lack of self-awareness in terminally online mtf trains? They wear unironically cringe shit that women won't wear, they wear cat ears and shit irl. Is it due to being neurodivergent? Has to be.

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They jack off to anime. Women IRL don't dress like anime because sane people aren't out there trying to look like cartoons. But these guys don't really know anything about 3D women, so when they transition, they dress like the fantasy of a woman they have made up in their head.

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Yesterday i saw a tall neurodivergent girl in cat ears loudly talking to her dead eyed mid 50s father lol i think trains base themselves off of neurodivergent biofoids they interact with on groomercord

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they dress how they want women to dress, which is influenced by their borderline pornographic harem animes

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For context, I'm 40+ and lesbian transfemme demigirl.

I- I'm sorry but I actually need this translated.

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Middle aged straight man pretending to be a gay tomboy.

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wearing pajamas and my "please be patient I have autism" cap and a band tee right now.

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pic?

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Reported by:

not wearing makeup rn and i was memeing cuz i don't have the hat. Tried to buy it once and it got mixed up with something else and I got kid's sized fortnite pajamas.

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Shenis. Now.

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Also talking about this with my therapist.

Every time. Reminder that this movement is manufactured by (((them))) and "therapists" are the foot soldiers

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therаpist

the rаpist

Coincidence? I think not

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![](https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7aD7AzI8pFkFlnag/giphy.webp)

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We all have internalised junk to work through. You've found yours which is a great start. Once you've got through that baggage, work on accepting trans bimbos and furries. They are all hecking valid and have a lot to teach us about being true to yourself in the face of stigma from all sides.

Alright who did this?

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I'm in my early 30s and dress like the goth girl I wanted to be when I was like 14

More lilely dresses like the 14 year old goth girl he wants to be inside of...

Also, lmao these inkwells have definitely never interacted with foids if they think its normal for women to dress like disney sissy porn whores. Pretty telling that their counterpoint is weebshit and cosplay conventions. Not their coworkers, friends, or family...

In closing, :#marseywoodchipper:

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:marseytrain2:s vs. AGP enjoyers

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As true as it is who cares about “the group”. Just be a normal person if you want to be and let the AGP people get their heads stomped in

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We're very aware that the female-dating-strategy subreddit is operated for the purpose of misinformation, cult-like indoctrination, promoting dysfunction and hatred and negative emotions.

There's an extremely excellent reason (backed up by hours of discussion, ten-thousand-word essays no one outside our mod team will ever read, and theory literature digging and reaching out to experts) why AHS does not put the words "incel" and "women" into the same noun phrase the way that you did in your comment here:

It's because one of the major methods of bad faith apologetics for hate movements is the Tu Quoque: "They're just as bad".

But -- importantly -- the female-dating-strategy is not:

pushing their members to remove condoms to commit rape;

pushing their members to commit rape;

pushing their members to assault men;

pushing their members to murder men;

pushing their members to stalk and terrorise men.

Importantly, there are no mass murders committed by FDS adherents. There are no restraining orders that we're aware of that cite the FDS subreddit. There are no men on Twitter stepping forward to say that members of the FDS movement are bombarding them with unwelcome tweets and direct messages, sexual advances, and photoshopping pornography of them.

In fact we cannot find any credible evidence that there are any groups of powerful women who take over institutions of power to leverage oppression of men as a whole class.

So calling them anything like "incels" is comparing sour apples to radium poisoning.

Snapshots:

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Trans women are beautiful and unique

![](https://media.giphy.com/media/9Q249Qsl5cfLi/giphy.webp)

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