[Long] An open discussion on rDrama’s development

Hello. Hi. Good morning.

rDrama has come to rely on internal top-level administrative polls for everything under the sun. Design by committee is, predictably, not a reliable method for getting anything fun done and is only meant to be used by large corporations because they need to move at a glacially slow pace to avoid ruining the experience of millions of users.

This is not the case with rDrama. We have about 1800 weekly users. Every aspect of every change does not, in my opinion, need to be put to a vote of 8-13 people. While polling of this sort is sometimes good and useful and necessary, this is not always the case. In my opinion.

As an example, I would like to provide two examples and your feedback on them is appreciated:

  1. The Yall Seeing Eye badge and award that was hated by the userbase and almost immediately revoked passed one of these committee votes. The backlash was immediate and it was undone. That’s a good name though, in keeping with the All Seeing Eye and Alt Seeing Eye, and the badge was cool. People wanted to use both, just not for the purpose provided. I proposed allowing users to buy it so they can see others’ self-deleted comments, just like mods can. The intended purpose of profile upgrade awards is to allow users to buy moderator-equivalent abilities, because it’s fun and cheeky and fits our spirit and declaws janitors to a small extent. This has been voted down because, quote, “it will blow up in our faces” and is “a terrible fricking idea.”

Would you have liked this?

  1. You can currently see your own deleted threads and comments, just like mods can. This allows you to undelete them if you want, or deleted it by accident, or delete it and then edit it to fix it and undelete it, and keeps you from permanently losing things you delete. It was recently voted to remove this ability for users: you will soon be unable to see things you delete. To clarify, we’ll still be able to see them - it’s a massive liability, otherwise - but you won’t, neither for reference nor for retrieval. Users like @Hotep and @MrPennySlavaUkraini have been vocal in condemning this as “r-slurred” and “why” and “do the people who vote on these even use the site frfr.”

Is this a change you, the user, foresee improving your rDrama experience?

Let me make clear that this thread is not a, quote, “daily narcissistic episode” - it is simply seeking user feedback on two key items in an attempt to either enact positive change in terms of development or quite possibly to prove my own self wrong in which case I will unconditionally support the design committee voting practices indefinitely.

Happy Thursday!


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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Please let us see the things weve deleted

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If jannies can do it, we should also be able to do it.

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Don't worry I can still see the comment I deleted

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I don't understand the point of this and can't think of one reason to change it, I like being able to link to deleted posts/comments, and it's one of the small things that makes the UI better than bigger sites

If anything you can add a permanently delete option to hide from all but jannies, but still seems pointless

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The rationale was that Reddit makes it so you can’t see your own self-deleted things, so we should too.


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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:marseywut2:

Can we start banning users who break reddiquette as well?

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dramaquette

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The rationale was that Reddit makes it so you can’t see your own self-deleted things, so we should too.

That's dumb as heck

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The rationale was that we should actively try to be more like Reddit for no particular reason?

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Reddit does have a lot of great concepts, to be fair. Not even being ironic. I just don’t personally think this is one of them and I don’t think we should be removing functionality and calling it a feature.


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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Implement great concepts because they're great, not because they're Reddit :marseyyikes:

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That's r-slurred and reddit unironically sucks. But I also liked downvoting poll options and hated when that was changed so maybe I'm just a dumb b-word who likes charm and character over boring and sterilized social media, but i think this is a horrible idea

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maybe I'm just a dumb b-word who likes charm and character over boring and sterilized social media

:marseyagree:


![](https://files.catbox.moe/y2zrro.png)

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Not gonna lie, I'm a bit dissapointed to see this leaf on leaf hate

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:#marseyrake:


![](https://files.catbox.moe/y2zrro.png)

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:#marseyropeyourselfmirror:

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Who suggested this? Lmao

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That's just trolling at this point come on lol

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please tell me u joking BIPOC we went offsite to stay away from all redditesque bullshit ffs who’s running cabal 🤦🏾‍♀️😤

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That's an r-slured fricking reason. Do better.

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:marseyxd:

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:marseygigaretard:

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So you preface your daily vanity episode with “rule by polling / democracy / committed is r-slurred and useless” but then close your daily vanity episode with “what does everyone think about my idea that we’re going to be doing anyways?”

Do you not see how r-slurred this is?

:marseygigaretard:


![](https://files.catbox.moe/y2zrro.png)

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If polling the userbase yields the polar opposite result of polling the committee then that shows a very obvious disconnect between what the committee thinks the userbase wants and what the userbase actually wants, thereby making the committee counterproductive, since the committee’s rationale is that they can anticipate user wants. If the userbase agrees with the committee on these two current items, then the committee’s importance is justified and I am in the wrong.


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The committee is full of r-slurs you know this already but at least it’s a small manageable amount of r-slurs. The community is generally going to agree with you because you’re an influencer and the community doesn’t care about larger implications like site functionality and legal shit.


![](https://files.catbox.moe/y2zrro.png)

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Brilliant logic. You were literally just crying about people repolling the same thing:

https://i.rdrama.net/images/16841405672750094.webp

Which somehow is terrible when it comes to anything you disagree with. Fine, fair enough. Except when it comes to your ideas, you first try to get Aevann/Snakes to do them just because you said so, when that fails - try arguing for it internally, and when that fails - bring it up to the userbase as though that is somehow the final arbiter.

And all that within 24 hours and without any cognitive dissonance whatsoever.

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Commie dislikes democracy

:marseypikachu2:

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Unironically. This isn't a democracy. Nobody on the mop team at all would want it to be a democracy, not even carp. This isn't a controversial issue.

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Good, then remove the internal voting team and let him make the decisions, because you and the other jannies obvs suck at making them. Dictatorship rules :marseycool2:

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Oh no! A guy whose various alts are half of my downvoters list doesn't trust my judgement! How will I ever recover?

:#marseydisintegrate:

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Muh downdoots! :marseycrying:

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I'm just saying that I don't give a shit about your opinion. It's terrible.

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You better hope I don’t get on that committee. My first action is to have a make a black friend award and you’re done for

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How would it work? Pitch it, we might actually implement it :marseyjam:

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Rather than just getting grassed and having to go outside. You have to have your hand and a black hand with your name on paper. Make a black friend award

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Darn, that is brilliant! :marseyxd:

Unfortunately wouldn't work (at all) for Europoors and ruralcels, in addition to schizo rightoids.

But I really, really like it in principle!

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oh you sweet summer child this isn't a democracy, all you have to do it be a decent human being, otherwise, there's the door

:marseysnoo:

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bring it up to the userbase as though that is somehow the final arbiter.

And this is why you shouldn't be a janny. Yes, the userbase of a site is the final arbiter of whether a feature is good or not, fricking r-slurred power tripping idiot

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No, it's not. Plus pretty much all JL3s know exactly how to manipulate the polls to get the result we want. I can provide you with examples of me, carp, and joan doing it at various times. It's not really that hard...

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I doubt it's to the level that we can just disregard any poll ever. And regardless, doesn't change what I said. If everyone hates the features you choose to implement and leaves, you will be jannying yourself. Users determine what works and doesn't, not you.

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All the rightoid schizo :marseyfreezepeach: sites you would like to turn this into are dogshit that nobody wants to visit ever. This one is growing. If an idea is implemented and userbase hates it a lot - we simply roll it back. This has happened before.

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Okay, so you agree with me. Users determine which features are viable, jannies do not.

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That's not what I said, lol. In fact I kind of said almost the exact opposite :marseyxd:

If we'd let democracy run rdrama.net - this would have been ruqqus by now.

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Now, now. You're both being r-slurred.

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Committee is r-slurred, let us see our deleted comments. Just make it an actual poll thread

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How many times was the commette wrong vs how many times was it right though?

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Don't bite a hand that is trying to feed you. :marseyeyeroll:

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Why was this posted to the music hole

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I am severely mentally handicapped 🥲


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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Many such cases

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:#marseykingcrown: :!#marseycarpautism:

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:marseycarphug:

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Not only should these changes not be implemented, but those who voted for them should be brought forth and publicly shamed for their gross display of redditfication!

![](/images/16547852515842667.webp)

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> create a reddit clone

> it either dies or becomes a reddit surrogate

many such cases are found in literature. Guess which path rDrama is going down?

:#marseyreading:

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Oh Jesus fricking Christ.

Let me repeat the same thing I said in the jannycord - unless you, carp, think that you're literally the second coming of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ - there is a definite possibility of you being wrong. The idea you came up with and are now bussy-blasted about was unanimously rejected because it was terrible. While I'm not going to publicly discuss it here (we don't really want to advertise the mechanics, afaik) - it would inevitably lead to massive problems very soon and continuously. I said so from the get-go:

https://i.rdrama.net/images/16841376538884718.webp

EVERYONE agreed. You tried to whine about it in cabal, then on main jannycord, and now publicly. This isn't going to change the fact that it just was a bad idea, and the "design by committee" worked as designed, since if it was a "one man one vote" democracy (with the fish being the man, him having the vote) - we'd have it coded already. With disastrous results.

Appealing to powerusers is not going to change this.

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Everyone did agree. Everyone also agreed that making profile views an exorbitantly expensive shop item to encourage paypigging to unlock it was also a good idea. Everyone sometimes agrees that bad ideas are very good ideas. That’s why this thread is here. To determine whether these ideas are good or bad ideas. Since they received unanimous committee support and your passionate support and opposition, they’re an excellent metric.

Furthermore:

![](/images/16547837908172963.webp)


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Furthermore:

Yeah, neighbor, I'm immune to your gaslighting. This comment was related to explaining the mechanics of how it will work, not the rationale for it.

![](/images/16547838994371734.webp)

Actual rationale was explained in the poll itself.

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Go on then. Post your rationale. The channel has since been purged, but the last time this was voted on it was because someone remembered three users complaining about being able to see their deleted comments on their profile.


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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Go on then. Post your rationale.

It wasn't my idea - tell snakes to post his rationale. My personal rationale (which you've now entirely destroyed, of course) was to cut down on people mass-overwriting their comments during their BPD moments.

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:marseyconfused: This is getting confusing. I'm not sure who is on which side and which side wants what anymore.

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Kind of feel stupid writing it out buried so deep... Maybe I'll buy a pin award for your comment or something so that people will actually see it.

Essentially what happened was that Kristallmopt led to a bunch of ex-JL2s losing their ability to view deleted comments. Carp came up with an idea of making seeing other people's deleted comments an expensive profile upgrade for powerusers.

I (and soon everyone else) have found that idea to be unspeakably r-slurred, and it failed unanimously.

https://i.rdrama.net/images/1684137490294144.webp

https://i.rdrama.net/images/16841374906429486.webp

Carp argued for it with something akin to "be cognisant of what you post", but didn't exactly find much support. Concurrently (pendulum swing) the idea of hiding deleted comments entirely was created, pretty much just for schizos to calm down. Carp didn't argue about that one at all, he was still pouting about his initial idea being rejected by the evil design-by-committee, as opposed to him just having unilateral control.

The latter idea is meh, I'm not attached to it. I doubt anyone really is. But this isn't the point - he's using it to gaslight people into believing that he should have unilateral control of new site mechanics so he can implement ideas like the former one without having to convince anyone that it's not r-slurred dogshit that will cause massive problems.

That's about it.

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Why does anyone want us to lose the ability to see our own deleted comments? Still don't understand after reading this.

Is "reddit does it that way" unironically the reasoning? :marseyyikes:

If he's the only one arguing that removing that feature is r-slurred than at least in this case he should have unilateral control and democracy has failed.

:marseycarphug:

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Is "reddit does it that way" unironically the reasoning? :marseyyikes:

No, that's gaslighting. The reddit bit was just an explanation of how it would work, on a visual level. The idea was to have schizos like you, for example, to think that deleted comments actually disappear and cut down on people mass-overwriting, which is becoming a bit of an issue tbh.

Of course if schizos know how it works, this isn't going to help :marseyshrug:. I have no problem with this idea being axed. I'd in fact vote against it now, as it became pointless.

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Democracy failed the day you r-slurs voted for cheaper deflector awards as if such wouldn't just be abused.

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All those words won't bring daddy back.

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nice hat

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I (and soon everyone else) have found that idea to be unspeakably r-slurred, and it failed unanimously.

How is it r-slurred?!?!? Just edit the comment if you actually seriously want it gone forever.

pretty much just for schizos to calm down

EDIT THE COMMENT OUT. Frick them if they are too stupid or lazy to do that.

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Well that was anticlimactic :marseysad:

thanks for the write up though. Almost got gaslit.

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Can't people do that anyway by editing them, since we don't archive? To me that's the real delete, since even jannies couldn't see it

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They can. The idea was to make it so they didn't think they'd have to. Now that it's all in the open - that rationale is gone, of course.

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Oh well that makes a lot of sense lol

I guess it's not really possible now, but why not have a schizo mode jannie toggle, that let's the unhinged have more peace of mind, while not changing things for everyone else

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lol, that would actually be funny :marseyxd:

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:marseypearlclutch: Carp exposed?

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I'm not going to publicly discuss it here

it's cool you can just tell me

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Others already did, so I guess I might as well, since this tantrum is spilling all internal discussions anyway. Carp wanted to go radically the other direction - allow powerusers to buy themselves a profile upgrade to see others' deleted comments. This was unanimously rejected and led to the poll he's complaining about now. Dialectics, pendulum swing, etc.

I'm honestly not that attached to the comments being removed, the point was to calm schizos down and cut down on people overwriting all their shit during spergouts. But it's really nbd...

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Others already did, so I guess I might as well, since this tantrum is spilling all internal discussions anyway. Carp wanted to go radically the other direction - allow powerusers to buy themselves a profile upgrade to see others' deleted comments.

I literally say this in the first bulletpoint. You are leaking the OP of the thread you are replying to.


https://i.rdrama.net/images/1707881499271494.webp https://i.rdrama.net/images/17101210991135056.webp

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Yeah, and it was a horrific idea. You'll get support from it from 3.5 powerusers, but in reality - it will literally run people off the site. And quickly.

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(Shitty english inbound) do so many people here write comments that they then delete and are so ashamed of that the possibility of some terminally online autist reading them would make them leave the site? Srs question

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Some people might. But the bigger issue is if it's available to anyone who can get DC, shitty comments can be thrown into each others' faces during shitflinging. That will absolutely bully people off the site.

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Since you're going frick all on democracy, remove unblockable.

I don't see how allowing people to curate what they want to see on this website would be anything other than a net positive.

It's not like many engage with the users they don't want to see, all it does is annoy people off the site.

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Since you're going frick all on democracy, remove unblockable.

Personally I'm not a fan of all these types (unblockable, fish, deflector) of awards/profile upgrades. They're essentially power-user exceptionalism, which we already have too much of built in simply due to the high learning curve for the site.

So you don't have to convince me.

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Absolute beta behavior

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They deserve it lmao

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Oh that's a bad idea.

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Fish, are you r-slured?

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:marseyagree:

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actually giving users the means of mopping is based

who gives a frick if the site becomes unusable, it's already buried under nonsense meta posts that no one gives a frick about

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My own comment is buried so I just wanted to say I agree with the change. Is it actually being reversed now?

Could there at least be a site toggle? Deleted stuff stays visible if you’ve the option enabled but disappears if the option is disabled? That way everyone is happy.

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I have no idea if that's practical. Ask @TwoLargeSnakesMating, he's currently doing most of the coding.

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it would inevitably lead to massive problems very soon and continuously.

WHAT PROBLEMS

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It's not happening, lol.

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You're just making up shit "it will cause problems" and you can't even conceive of what those problems would be

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I can easily conceive of it. If every sperg that got 20k :marseycoin: from trainposting for a month can see everyone else's deleted drunkposting when browsing their profiles, we'll get a lot more doxxing and shit originating from this site. And constant, boring, beefs being rehashed via throwing (old, deleted) comments at each other.

There's literally no benefit to it, and it's something that will scare normal people away.

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That's a personal problem. They should be shamed for being dumb enough to not check their post history, or for not overwriting.

And constant, boring, beefs being rehashed via throwing (old, deleted) comments at each other.

Dramaphobic.

we'll get a lot more doxxing

If someone posts their address on a public website, and someone actually mails something dumb to them like a gianormous dildo, who is at fault? The idiot who posted his address, or the troublemaker who mailed the dildo?

Users should be held accountable for their own actions.

and it's something that will scare normal people away.

You want to attract normies? There are a myriad worse things on this site that repel normies. Like the incel lingo, KYSposting, and many of the Marseys we have.

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Yeah, we're not doing that. "Personal problem" "should be ashamed" aren't valid arguments. If you want to hold people accountable for their actions by doxxing them and shit - feel free to join kiwifarms.

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They're doxxing themselves. And even then, this entire doxxing argument you have conjured is a moot point - edit and overwrite the comment. Everyone should know how to do it as is. But you want your userbase to be ignorant of their privacy and how to protect it.

You want to actually resolve the problem? How about writing and pinning a guide on what you as a user can do to safely curate the information you let out, that includes information such as how your deleted comments are actually viewable by the mod staff, and that if you really want it gone, overwrite it.

But the decision of leadership is to do the complete opposite. You want to further ignorance so the users think that they have privacy, when they clearly do not, and you want to take away any indication that would give a user the truth on who can see their information. How are we supposed to trust you guys when you don't even want to be upfront about the most important and fundamental rights a user on the Internet ought to have?

You also expect us to totally trust everyone in leadership with our information which you want to mislead us into believing it is gone for good. What if someone on your team is removed and retaliates? What if someone has a tantrum? What if someone develops such a strong beef against a user here that they abuse their ability to see their information? We're on a goddarn gay cat cult where the majority of visitors are neurodivergent INTPs. Retaliatory abuse and the related already happens in real world governments and corporations, and somehow the rDrama team which is certainly more neurodivergent and prone to breakdowns could never do such a thing?

You deceive the users, you take steps to prevent overwriting of comments by being opaque with how you handle OUR information, and inevitably you WILL frick up. You're worried about a shitstorm? You are looking in the wrong place. This very policy that you want to implement will be the progenitor of a scandal in the future that would be a blight on this site and the admins, permanently.

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I don't care. We're not letting random sociopaths access it. It's a terrible idea. Also there's just NO FRICKING UPSIDE WHATSOEVER!

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