Cool story, bro

Snapshots:

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Second bomb should have fallen on Los Angeles tbh.

Nah fam, third and fourth should have.

But it wasn't shitty back then

Triggered commiefornian.

Opposite. Nuke it now, not then

Nuke the past to change the present

This kind of thinking is why no one killed Hitler as a baby.

So, have Fat man fall onto fat men?

Bad Religion already did it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxoD9zWY9Rg

Late-stage Bad Religion, really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bn75iC386-w

I for one cannot wait til the big one hits California and it falls into the ocean

That's not how that works

people don't know shit about geology

Falls into ocean sounds much better than rams into Alaska, so I don't blame him

Ey fuck you bud

Did someone just say there is cheating in war?

Since WWI using chemical wepons is against the Geneva convention. So technically if you use chemical weppons on an ememy then you're breaking the rules

If your county is signatory to the Geneva convention

making rules for war

Pretty stupid

gotta give the other side a sporting chance

It's honestly more that you can't really wage war if you use these weapons. You end up killing lots of people, including many of your own, and it turns most battles into a matter of getting lucky with where your gas weapons land, than any actual fight or strategy.

The reason you can use many of these weapons against protesters is that you don't then go around shooting the completely disabled combatants.

All you have to do is win the war then there were no broken rules. Best part winning the war gives you the ability prosecute the losers with non-existing rules.

Nukes aren't chemical weapons.

When it comes to war, you do whatever then the winner decides if any rules were broken

This is what happens when you play too many online MMOs.

Did someone just say there is cheating in war?

Yeah, as they say, all is fair in love and war =)

Ranged combat in general is for pussies. Real men would just punch each other to death, and wars should be resolved in one big brawl or by putting the leaders of both countries in the octagon.

in the octagon THUNDERDOME!!!

🎶 We don't need another hero! ♫ 🎹 🎷🎶

Pls real men don't even need weapons. Real honor is flying yourself into someone.

is punch a weapons

Hands can be classified as deadly weapons, if you're a man. Just don't put them in your pockets, or you might get prosecuted for concealed carry.

Hands can be classified as deadly weapons, if you're a man. kung-fu master

punch yerself fgt

finally i can use this link!

It's not like Japan had any hope of winning the war if we didn't drop the bombs. They were a tough enemy, but they had inferior manufacturing capacity, and out dated technology. For example, Japan's small arms technology paled in comparison to the US, Germany, and Russia. I don't even think they ever adopted a semi auto rifle in large numbers like the three countries I mentioned did.

Yeah tbh the Japanese guns in World at War are ass. no wonder they lost.

Real men fight with swords

Nippon steel swords folded over a 1000 times?

I'm only half nip. I have no idea

I guess they just fold them 500 times you you guys

They were great if you wanted to attach a bayonet to your LMG.

LMG without bayonettu is like schoolgirra not being rapedu by tentacles.

A Type 99 reference? Deep cut.

I think it was more about getting it done and over with rather then the protracted fight for every inch the way it happened in germany.

The offensives in Germany after the Rhine crossings were largely absolute blowouts, though. The 'rush b' mentality of the Ardennes offensive basically ruined any combat power they had left, after that it was the Western Allies feeding them their own fingers.

You read about a lot of hilarious anecdotes of German kids in uniform running screaming towards American lines to surrender while under fire from their own. The regime's facade had been starting to break under the combined retard strength of both the West and the USSR for a while.

Japan was too fucking retarded to realize they had lost though. There definitely would've been absolute mental retardation for every square inch of Japanese soil, and Okinawa gave the Americans enough of a taste to realize it was going to be a fucking shitshow. The idea of Americans mowing down Japanese schoolgirls attacking with sharpened bamboo sticks warms my degenerate heart, though.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Berlin

Non-Mobile link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Berlin

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Wew lad, I'm speaking about the Western allies. Perhaps you could try reading.

Wew laddy, it would have have been pretty straight stupid to ignore lessons learned by the soviets.

Not mention the Heavy tolls suffered during all the other island invasions in the pacific. To pretend an invasion of Japan mainland would have been some kind of cakewalk is making you look retarded and the US knew it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Downfall

A planned investment of 6 million troops on multiple landing sites with 4.5 million Japanese troops on the island and a possible 35 million civilian conscripts.

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Never said there wasn't anything to learn from the Soviets, but k. Their Bagration offensive remains the single greatest land operation in military history for decisiveness.

They just went full retard thereafter.

Gas yourself wikiwarrior lmao.

They don't understand that there is a very deep difference in the mentality of westerns and easterners. I wouldn't believe it either if I hadn't met a number of easterners.

In a lot of ways, they just downright don't think the way we do.

You read about a lot of hilarious anecdotes of German kids in uniform running screaming towards American lines to surrender while under fire from their own.

I had a history prof that would tell us stories from the war like this. In one case they knew that the hitler youth were in the area to destroy tanks, so they had a guy go in front of the tanks with a big bag of chocolate bars and give one to any kid to surrendered his weapons. When the kids realized they wouldn't get shot or arrested, they all gave up their weapons.

That's also because we treated surrendered Germans so well. Each one was driven in a private car to their POW summer camp. It's hard to maintain your will to fight when your enemy is using sedans to move POWs, and you have to use horses to move ammo.

Turns out that an enemy that knows they will be killed on surrender, is very reluctant to surrender. That's how you get total shit shows like the Eastern Front. Japanese propaganda was very effective at getting soldiers to believe the will be killed when captured, and made for a lot more dead US soldiers than there would have been otherwise.

Yes German prisoners were on the whole treated much better by the Western powers. The barbarity on the Eastern front towards captures started basically immediately; something like 3 million of the Soviet Union's 11 million military losses were actually just Prisoners taken in the initial invasion that the Germans starved, slaughtered or worked to death. Shit like that breeds vendettas. It's little wonder things spun out of control.

That's what happens when the two opponents declare the other's ideology to be utterly irreconcilble and one side decides to throw race into the mix because let's make things more retarded.

HUMINT/POW intel remains one of the best sources for relatively up-to-date information. Killing/mistreating prisoners is retarded for more than just moral reasons.

Proof. As a former Army interrogator we were trained that offering a sympathetic ear and a shoulder to cry on is by far the most effective means of gathering intelligence from captured personnel.

Japan realized it lost. It's just that their culture had gotten really, really far (name another non-western combatant that was on that level in the 1940s) with their 'We will not surrender' bullshit, and it can be very hard to change a tactic that's been so successful.

Plus, Island people always have a 'we can't be invaded' mentality, even if they've been invaded many times before.

By the time the bombs were dropped, the wars conclusion was 100% certain: Alkued custody. By that stage the world powers were now jockeying for control over a post war world. This is context I see the bombings in. Truman needed the Soviets to see that the USA had something that trumped Stalins masses of troops. I see the two atomic blasts as a warning: don't fucking try us, Uncle Joe.

Isn't that a trope? Most academic literature on the subject emphasise the fact that Truman didn't have all that much choice. This was very much a 'we have them and will use them.'

I think what it highlights is that there were many good reasons at the time for dropping the bombs. The US was concerned about the Soviets making significant gains in the Asia Pacific. It was clear the Soviets were playing for keepsies in Europe, and the last thing the US wanted was another industrially super productive area of the world falling under the sway of their new enemy.

Fair point. Whatever the initial thought process the effects were manifold.

Japan was too fucking retarded to realize they had lost though.

I don't know that that's really true. The cabinet definitely seemed to know that they were beaten.

What they thought, however, was that all they needed was one last devastating victory over the Allies (or at least to force the Allies to incur a very costly Pyrrhic victory), which would net them significantly better terms in the ultimate surrender negotiations. They really didn't want to surrender unconditionally. There's a good discussion of this in Max Hastings's Retribution.

Or the simply reasons why they used nukes. It's because it was simply a larger bomb. They were planning to drop more nukes on the japan. It's not like they gave toss about ethics of causing civil casualties.

They bombed everything with military value.

Yea, attacking pearl harbour was a mistake.

they put too many ability points in rape. need to reroll.

They would have lost, but they wouldn't have been put down easily.

Kill tens of thousands of them. Or have have them kill tens of thousands of us AND us kill hundreds of thousands of them.

It's a shit decision to have to make, but I wouldn't trust any man who claims he wouldn't make the same decision Truman did.

Well as a half Nip i only have one thing too say. Hirahito did nothing wrong

Hirahito

It's Uh actually Hirohito

Maybe it's his evil good twin?

Especially when Hirohito ordered the Japanese to commit suicide en masse rather than surrender.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_Cliff

If only the rest of the 日本鬼子 nation had followed their God Emperor's order and killed themselves, then today we would not have these hundreds of thousands of degenerate anime fans and autistic weeb gamers running around like a bunch of retards, ruining the internet for all of us good, clean, decent, pious folk.

You know there are white weebs right? Sure the mayocide will take care of that but yeah.

mayocide will take care of that

tbqh I prefer "the Mayolocaust" to "mayocide" because it sounds more efficient and industrialised

The attack on Pearl Harbor was just ahead of the curve.

/u/Sour_J I sensually jerk off to the second atomic bombing of Japan. Freedom won.

This article has an interesting perspective on the matter - that the atomic bombs dropped on Japan didn't cause them to surrender; Russia declaring war on Japan did.

I'm reminded of it every time this topic comes up.

Think about it. A foreign country dropped two of the most powerful bombs the world has ever seen, leveling two cities in a short amount of time. The implied threat is that they could bomb the entire fucking Island multiple times over with ease. You don't think this caused them to surrender?

The article posits that the radiation poisoning risk wasn't known at the time, and with the majority of buildings in Japan being built of wood, the fire bombing raids the US was conducting on a daily basis was causing comparable initial damage. The bombs effect would have been lost in the noise to the Japanese government.

Who gives a shit about radiation poising when the ENTIRE country could be bombed killing everyone immediately? If you discover a technology like the nuclear bomb when everyone is busy using rifles and shit, you are going to win. That simple.

...Did you even read the article?

No have to register, would like to hear the rationale tho

I didn't register to read it. Their registration box is just very intrusive. I closed the box, and if the site redirected me to the main page, I went back to the article and closed the box again.

If that doesn't work, I'll be able to upload a pdf to a file sharing site after work. Just let me know.

Just thinking of it logically tho, let's say Russia didn't threaten war and it was just USA vs Japan. What options does Japan have? Create a new base away from Japan? Nuked. Somehow create a giant fleet? Port nuked. Send in fighter planes? Airport nuked. If the USA was bored it could nuke fucking tokyo. What would the do at that point? I think you are underestimating the power of nukes dude lol.

But the Japanese were aware of that way before the bomb. Of the potential of nuclear bombs and the fact that the Americans could bomb the island many times over without nukes. Almost every important city in Japan had already been burned to the ground before the nukes came.

Why not both?

The talks about surrender was already gaining traction after the bombs dropped, it's just some numbnuts in the government still think they should fight to the last men (and women, and children). Then the August Storm destroyed their "last hope," and the pro-surrender side got more strength to push it through.

Don't forget, some young officers still tried to storm the palace to prevent the broadcast being sent to the broadcasting station.

That's an interesting article, but of course it spins its own point as hard as possible while neglecting the counterpoints completely. My 'tism is all hot and bothered and I can't resist.

For starters, it severely downplays the perception of the bombing. Yeah, 500 bombers in a raid, with all their aircraft carriers and support chains, can deliver one quarter of the damage caused by a single bomber dropping one bomb. And then there's a second bomb dropped three days later, and you don't know, maybe they can keep up doing this? That spells "the opponent suddenly has an order or two of magnitude more efficient trades, you couldn't keep up before but now you can't keep up catastrophically".

Reminder: 20 kilotons means that about 20,000 tons of conventional bombs must be produced in the US and shipped to the aircraft carriers and carried over by bombers and dropped, while sustaining anti-aircraft fire. And now it's a single high-altitude bomber carrying a single bomb.

Then, the "there were not many cities left to bomb", sure, the point is that a 500 bomber raid on one of their island fortresses would lose many bombers for not much damage (compared to usual cities, since it's so much more fortified), while dropping a nuke would obliterate quite a lot of stuff there.

But the main point is that, with all of the above in mind, consider this: the bombing of Hiroshima was what caused the Soviet declaration of war in the first place. Obviously. For all his nitpicking about the timing of the surrender and preceding events, the author completely ignored this elephant in the room.

Yeah, if the US decided on a conventional invasion, Stalin would've happily maintained neutrality while watching his enemies mutually wasting tremendous amounts of each other's personnel and materiel, then brokered for peace after invading anyway at the opportune moment to take as big a bite of Japan as possible. Probably.

The nuking of Hiroshima sent a message to Stalin as much as to anyone: Japan is not long for this world, there's blood in the water, attack now so that you can get places like the Kurils for yourself, and a lot of places like Mongolia and North Korea for the fellow communists, and also publicly align with the winning side, or all spoils of war will go to the US apparently for free.

So here you have it, on August 6, 1945 Hiroshima is nuked, on August 9 Soviets declare war on Japan and invade everything they can while the US nukes Nagasaki, on August 15 Japan surrenders to the US.

I mean, slice and dice it however you want, but it's just wrong to say that it really was the Soviet declaration of war that did it for Japan's willingness to fight, not the realization that your enemy now can obliterate a city with a single bomber, while ignoring the quite obvious fact that the Soviet declaration of war on Japan was a consequence of deploying nuclear weapons as well.

USA: IDKFA

Man, I went to dig through his user history find other shit comments, but it took me two seconds to find the title "Whos this pornstar?"

It's like he couldn't decide if the right word to use was who's or whose, and decided to settle halfway.

So is it cheating if Best Korea uses their bomb on us? Someone correct the record here for me and OP.

WW2 America OP Nerf Plz.

America is overpowered. Pls nerf. Thx.

Always curious if these people think Japan wouldn't have nuked America.