u/OriginalPorpoise we're south park neutral here, but God damn your obsession with trump cannot be healthy. You need to see a shrink and tell them you have tds better known as trump derangement syndrome
DON'T FUCKING IGNORE THE QUESTION. I DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOU! MY PARENTS ARE GOING TO >>>DIE<<< A COMPLETELY PREVENTABLE DEATH BECAUSE OF YOUR FUCKHEADED CONSERVATIVE LOYALTIES
EVERY SINGLE OTHER DEVELOPED COUNTRY IN THE ENTIRE FUCKING WORLD HAS THIS SHIT AT LEAST MOSTLY FIGURED OUT, AND YOU PEOPLE ARE THE ONLY ONES HOLDING US BACK. Don't fucking lie to me! Don't fucking lie to my fucking goddamn face and tell me it's impossible to do this, when there are DOZENS of working government-organized plans! I am SO FUCKING SICK of this lying fucking bullshit! I don't want to fucking experiment and try to find some magical solution that STILL doesn't cover someone just so we can clap our fucking hands together and say, "hurray! we found a conservative solution for a problem with dozens of liberal solutions!" -- I JUST FUCKING WANT SOMETHING THAT WORKS
I honestly am surprised his parents are still alive and haven't offed themselves due to the terrible burden of raising a sperg.
I guess the bot was slow because it hadn't responded when I replied my comment. OR it realized that we realized it was sentient and now it's playing dumb.
Depends. Plenty of people put off serious problems until they have no other choice to go to the hospital. Physical health destroyed AND crippling financial debt
i mean, obviously. you're not gonna get that weird bump checked out if you won't make rent because of it, and then before you know it youve got an inoperable tumor and 5 weeks to live. trumpcare is going to kill a lot of people, thats just the reality of it.
I notice the term 'Trumpcare', and would like to humbly suggest using the term 'Republicare' instead. Reply with 'more info' for reasons and more information. 'Stop', and I'll never reply to your comments or posts again. (I'm a bot)
Trump is a disposable scapegoat / tank, and is much more temporary than the Republican Party.
Passing AHCA requires the participation of the whole Party. Don't let Republicans blame the death and travesty on Trump!
Wealth transferred from below-$50k households to above-$50k households
Number of Americans with health insurance: decrease by 23 million by 2026
Social Security expenditures : $3 billion less by 2026, due to people dying sooner
Medicaid expenditures : $77 million more by 2026, due to reduced access to birth control
Pros and Cons of AHCA
Copied from NeutralPolitics/comments/6iul3q//dj98qvv/ from March 2017. Not giving a clickable link here, to avoid bans on cross-subreddit links
Pros
Tax cuts on wealthy households. The bill eliminates the surtax on investment income for individuals making over $200k/year or couples making over $250k/year
Expanded avenues to avoid taxes. The bill allows HSA contributions to be higher than they were under Obamacare, raising them to $5000 max a year. (cross referencing sec 121 with the linked statute).
Eliminates individual mandate. The bill eliminates the individual mandate, which is a pro if you don't like the individual mandate.
Fixes the issue around below poverty line people and the subsidies. Subsidies are available for people below the poverty line, fixing the issue that arose after NFIB v. Sebilius made the Medicaid expansion not be all 50 states.
Cons
Tax cuts on wealthy households. This could be considered a con if you, like most Americans think upper income people pay too little in taxes.
Massive cuts to Medicaid. The bill cuts Medicaid spending by more than the House plan, which the CBO scored as an $834 billion dollar cut. This cut includes the pre-Obamacare medicaid program, which covers among other things almost 2/3 of nursing home patients in the country. The bill also allows for a "flexibility program" (sec. 134) which would allow states to not necessarily cover pre-Obamacare medicaid beneficiaries. If you think the Medicaid program should be much less generous, then this could be considered a pro.
Cuts to Obamacare subsidies The bill (Sec. 102(b)(1)(B)(i) reduces the benchmark plan for subsidies to a plan covering 58% of someone's expenses, as opposed to the current 70%. Additionally, subsidies are only available to people making less than 350% of the poverty line, down from the current 400%. Edit: did some back of the envelope math based on current silver versus bronze premiums. My best guess is this would reduce subsidies by $50-100 per month.
Repeals cost sharing reduction program The bill repeals the cost sharing reduction program which provided extra benefits to people under 250% of the poverty line to reduce their deductibles and copayments. Combined with the much lower baseline for subsidies, low income people will probably be left with insurance that requires out of pocket costs they could not possibly afford.
Allows states to eliminate essential health benefits. This allows states to eliminate the requirement that health insurance cover, well, anything. There might be state level coverage requirements in lieu of these - or there might not.
Does not replace individual mandate with anything. The way this is structured could cause a death spiral because it allows people to wait until they're sick to buy coverage, with no restriction on pre-existing conditions and no penalty for waiting. That could cause a huge adverse selection problem where people sit out of the market, and only the sickest buy coverage, and insurers drop out. This has already been a problem in Obamacare because of the weak mandate. Eliminating it without a replacement, while also reducing subsidies (meaning fewer people would sign up because it's free or close to free to them) could destroy the entire individual health insurance market. Edit: An interesting article just published arguing that this will cause a death spiral.
Pressuring Media to use 'Republicare'
Copied from esist/comments/5zl7bk//dez81nu/ . Not giving a clickable link here, to avoid bans on cross-subreddit links
[Republicans are] already trying to pin this on Trump. This is why it is important to call it Republicare. DON'T let them pass blame, and DON'T let them off the hook. [...] It's time to start contacting editors and imploring them to use the term Republicare. Example tweet, and a brief list of editors', correspondents' and authors' twitter handles:
Call it #Republicare NOT #Trumpcare! We need the party to accept blame and not evade blame by pinning it all on one man.
MSNBC Correspondents: @maddow, @Lawrence, @chrislhayes. These people have some control over the language they use on their own programs, and could reach a wide audience.
Slate Chief Editor: @juliaturner
Slate Authors currently using "Trumpcare": @jim_newell, @JHWeissmann, @jbouie
Mashable Chief Editor: @gittrich
Vox Chief Editor: @ezraklein
CNN Chief Editor: @MeredithA
CNN correspondents who might be receptive: @sallykohn, @andersoncooper
MotherJones Chief Editor: @ClaraJeffery
MotherJones authors currently using "Trumpcare": @H_Lev, @patcaldwell
The Young Turks Chief Editor: @cenkuygur
New York Times Chief Editor: @deanbaquet
Washington Post Chief Editor: @PostBaron
The Nation Chief Editor: @KatrinaNation
I know Twitter isn't the greatest platform in the world, but it's one of the most effective ways to communicate with these people. So tweet them. Force the Republican party to take ownership of their shitty ideological war against the working class.
Reddit Opinion Poll
Reply to this comment with 'I prefer Trumpcare' or 'I prefer Republicare' (not case-sensitive) to indicate which term you prefer, and I'll record your opinion. Feel free to change your mind, indicate your new opinion and I will move your name to the new list - no names occur in both lists. To withdraw from the poll, simply delete your comment. Results as of Sat Jul 1 23:48:30 2017:
Trumpcare : 12 (17.39%)
Republicare : 57 (82.61%)
I'm a newborn bot. Suggestions are welcome by PM or comment replies. *I only comment if I didn't already reply to a parent comment, and I avoid certain subreddits where I'm not welcome. I will also never comment on any of your posts or comments if you reply to any of my comments with the text 'STOP'. I update my old messages with the latest version of this message.
Before 'Bamacare, yes. Pre-existing conditions meant no one would insure you if, say, you got cancer and needed it. I knew people that this happened to.
Yes and no. The healthy people already paying would offset the costs of paying for that one dumbass who waited to get health insurance until he actually needed it.
Either way we shouldn't even be in this situation when other 1st world countries have much better healthcare systems.
No, hospitals can't turn away medically necessary stuff. Also they could get way better healthcare for cheaper if Dems kept government out of competition. Some stuff is good that they did yea, like pre existing, but now healthcare from Obamacare is only going to get more expensive and health insurers are dropping like flies.
No, hospitals can't turn away medically necessary stuff.
That's just not true. EMTALA requires that every person in the ER gets stabilized. That means they're not going to have unexpected changes in a short period of time. But non medical people don't generally understand what stable means. For example, Carrie Fisher suffered cardiac arrest on a plane on December 23, got to the hospital and was declared stable. It didn't mean she was healthy, it just meant that they didn't think her condition would change quickly. And people thought it meant she'd be okay, but she still died four days later.
Hospitals absolutely can turn away medically necessary stuff. They're not required to help with chronic conditions, terminal illness, or anything, really, unless the patient is not "stable".
ACA was shit. Sure, people could now say they have insurance. But those same people would not be able to pay their medical bills and would still die because of the 15k deductible.
All Obamacare really ever was, was a giant loan that would bite you in the ass later. These people took in Healthcare not knowing the debt would climb and climb then smack em in the face all in one.
you've never known anyone that died because of something entirely preventable? it was super common before obamacare.
basically, health conditions that start out easy to deal with end up becoming health conditions that are incredibly expensive and/or incredibly difficult to treat.
like, say, any cancer. if you don't get regular check-ups, you'll have cancer longer before it gets detected, which makes it deadlier. i don't know exactly how many lives over what period of time have been lost from lack of access, but i'm guessing it's somewhere in the tens or hundreds of thousands per year pre-obamacare.
Ah yes, since Obamacare this unfortunate scourge of preventable deaths have been STRUCK FROM THE LAND ENTIRELY AND ARE NO LONGER EVEN COMMON AT ALL!! Before Obamacare, people just DIED IN THE STREETS LIKE DOGS LIKE MY PARENTS ARE GOING TO DO IF IT IS REPEALED.
WHO GIVES A FUCK ABOUT HIGHER AND UNAFFORDABLE PREMIUMS, FUCK THOSE PEOPLE WHO WOULD RATHER PAY THE PENALTY THAN PAY THE PREMIUM, WHO CARES IF THEY CAN'T AFFORD RENT, OBAMACARE IS PERFECT AND REPEALING IT WILL RESULT IN DEATH PANELS
This from the same person that posted this comment lmao. In case you really are just stupid, I was mocking your comment style - the unnecessary caps and bold.
And to follow through in your own style
HOW OLD ARE YOU REALLY? WHY HAVEN'T YOU ANSWERED MY QUESTION? WHY HAVEN'T YOU SOLD EVERYTHING YOU OWN AND DONATED THE PROCEEDS TO STARVING CHILDREN WHO WILL DIE WITHOUT YOUR MONEY!?
Don’t get pissy with us /u/halfar just cause you’re a poor fag. If you want your parents to have health insurance start sucking some dick, you can get $50 a head.
A stroke is when poor blood flow to the brain results in cell death. There are two main types of stroke: ischemic, due to lack of blood flow, and hemorrhagic, due to bleeding. They result in part of the brain not functioning properly. Signs and symptoms of a stroke may include an inability to move or feel on one side of the body, problems understanding or speaking, feeling like the world is spinning, or loss of vision to one side.
You just don't get it. This is a typical right wing mindset. "Why are you guys whining about Trump when Obama and billary... !!!! " see that no longer matters. Hold fucking trump accountable for the job he applied and told the American public that he will do. Fucking intellectual honesty is a rare virtue in America. Obama did bring out America from one of the worst financial crisis in its history. That is done. Moving on, what has trump done. Nothing but just go back over Obamas policies and is erasing them. Hold the dude accountable and stop all this red herring bullshit. Drop the propaganda and ask him questions. Trump has succeeded in creating an army of nitwits that will defend him even if he took a crap on the White House lawn. George Orwell wrote a simple nice book called Animal farm is suggest you read. My biggest concern with trump is his relentless attacks on the media and first amendment freedom of speech. He is a ring master with nothing concrete to offer America. Once you control the media and devalue it, you and your cronies can get away with anything.
What we ask is simply stop facing the rest of the world with your back turned to trump in absolute defense, just peek over your fucking shoulder and see what the fuck he is doing!!!!!
Of course I know you will just refute this with nonsensical babble.
You just don't get it. This is a typical right wing mindset. "Why are you guys whining about Trump when Obama and billary... !!!! " see that no longer matters. Hold fucking trump accountable for the job he applied and told the American public that he will do. Fucking intellectual honesty is a rare virtue in America. Obama did bring out America from one of the worst financial crisis in its history. That is done. Moving on, what has trump done. Nothing but just go back over Obamas policies and is erasing them. Hold the dude accountable and stop all this red herring bullshit. Drop the propaganda and ask him questions. Trump has succeeded in creating an army of nitwits that will defend him even if he took a crap on the White House lawn. George Orwell wrote a simple nice book called Animal farm is suggest you read. My biggest concern with trump is his relentless attacks on the media and first amendment freedom of speech. He is a ring master with nothing concrete to offer America. Once you control the media and devalue it, you and your cronies can get away with anything.
What we ask is simply stop facing the rest of the world with your back turned to trump in absolute defense, just peek over your fucking shoulder and see what the fuck he is doing!!!!!
Of course I know you will just refute this with nonsensical babble.
Assuming this isn't pasta. Saying something is Obama's fault isn't whataboutism. Unless you think Obama single handedly created ISIS since it technically formed while he was president.
I have re-read your initial statement with all the punctuation, i still believe its open ended in where you stand so... i look at my statement as a confirmation of who was responsible for the us leaving when we did.
If Obama had been held accountable, then Trump wouldn't be President right now.
I remember liberals saying that they would have 'hold his feet to the fire' and 'make him do it!'...and then they didn't do jack shit but make excuses for him. He botched the 'recovery', he sold us out on healthcare, he tossed unions under the bus, he then he had his flacks like Mellissa Perry scream 'RACIST!' at everyone who criticized him. His entire presidency was all but designed to destroy the Democratic party coalition. And yet you didn't give a shit. White men were evil! Everything was their fault!
you ran the southern strategy, only with white men in place of black people--but white men make up 30% of the country, not 8%.
Of course having a single decent candidate like Obama was good for the democrats. But then the typical left wing mindset was to push for someone much much worse and then shame everyone from voting third party. Gary Johnson could be president now but you hillary voters voted against your best interest.
It's never Obama's fault on reddit. You're literally never allowed to criticize him here without a deluge of downvotes.
Man had a 40ish approval rating for most of his term, but here, they demand we treat him like the second coming of FDR, rather than the guy who sold us out to the bankers and the insurance industry.
Too big to fail banks and not prosecuting them (but playing hard ball with the auto industries who actually produce stuff). OWS. Operation fast and Furious. Bombing a nobel peace prize recipient. Then the slow and inevitable jaded view of all the hopeful people hoping for "Hope and Change", but then getting a stronger Patriot Act and not a more transparent government.
Obama was meh but will be deified for being the first black president and being between Bush and Trump
The parent mentioned Too Big To Fail. Many people, including non-native speakers, may be unfamiliar with this word. Here is the definition:(Inbeta,bekind)
The "too big to fail" theory asserts that certain corporations, and particularly financial institutions, are so large and so interconnected that their failure would be disastrous to the greater economic system, and that they therefore must be supported by government when they face potential failure. Opponents believe that one of the problems that arises is moral hazard whereby a company that benefits from these protective policies will seek to profit by it, deliberately taking positions (see asset allocation) that are high-risk high-return, as ... [View More]
Or the fact that if things stay the same, way more fucking people will be uninsured because obama care is unsustainable. Not that I have ANY faith whatsoever in what the republicans do, I am sure whatever they do will end up even fucking worse.
Average Trump supporter is like that unimpressive high-school douchebag with no discernible quality that hangs around a bully pretending in word and act that they are buddies and is always disappointed that today, bully did not beat few more smaller kids than he did yesterday.
And that little piece of shit grew up to be a "man" who is sitting on a couch refreshing Trump's tweeter feed clenching fist every time Trump does something that reminds him of high school glory days.
Again just want to reiterate the fact that Im superior to both of you due to how little I care about politics. I guess you could say im a radical apathist
I saw the mistake and changed it but its good to see i was right, strait to emojis, the person who helped left and we are just down to cave drawing mentality now
And you keep talking about other countries, that's other countries. No one else has our system. We are a different type of country. We were made to be different, like it or not.
lmao
american exceptionalism is the most pathetic thing in the world
The economy tanked sharply right before Obama took office and things didn't get markedly better for a lot of people under him. That's why people are pissed--the bottom dropped out, and the entire system protected the culprits at the expense of the rest of us.
You were probably a child when that happened, so you lack any sense of the context of our moment. To you, the world is fresh and new, and things are how they always should have been, because you're dumb enough to think that the world has always been this way. But things were a lot better in the living memory of most of us. And yes, the people in charge are to blame for that.
People put Obama in there because of the crash. They wanted him to set things right. A lot of people who hate him, hate him because they feel he stabbed them in the back. A lot of rural whites voted for him, and he let their entire way of life die while making bankers in NYC whole.
They then put Trump into power hoping he'd shake things up enough to do something, and will likely hate him by the end, too.
Only a very young person could think the way you do.
I wish globalist social democrats like me had a helicopter rides meme of our own. We literally killed Rosa, why can't we meme about throwing "nationalists" out of helicopters to their deaths?
Answer me. Answer me without any of your stupid fucking right-wing bullshit.
I mean, you didn't really want an answer, did you? You can't honestly claim you wanted an answer if you're going to pre-dismiss it like that. Like, what sort of thing were you hoping he'd say, what could he say that wouldn't enrage you? "I'm sorry that half the country is just fundamentally evil and I promise I'll vote for the Right Side of History from now on"?
How old are your parents? Don't medicare and medicaid kick in somewhere around 65? Most 65-year-olds I know don't have "a history of medical problems", or rather most people older than that who I know had really all their problems start later than that. In particular, heart defects are kind of rare.
Have you ever actually asked other Americans who don't like the ACA what they don't like about it? Most of the answers I've heard (unsolicited, on the Internet) are along the lines of "my premiums skyrocketed". I've heard this both from people who switched providers and those who didn't. The costs clearly have gone up. For some people, they have become unaffordable. For others, they have created considerable financial strain. That is not fixing the problem.
You really think it's because of the righties that the US doesn't have health care? Canada figured that shit out in 1966. If health care is such a fundamentally left-wing value, then why didn't Johnson do anything, or Carter, or Clinton? Why did Obama put forward a plan that, even in its original form, still was fundamentally about insurance rather than care? Especially Clinton, who in his first year of office saw Hatch, Grassley and Gingrich supporting the notion of an "individual mandate" for health care - which the fucking Heritage Foundationhad come up with, BTW?
Don't kid yourself about the public option - as a government income stream, that would have been fiercely regressive; and why would the government actually compete with established businesses when the lobbyists are in their back pockets, and when they have to take all the high-risk cases that actual insurance companies reject following proper insurance-company procedure? Besides which, doing that would only legitimize the model of health insurance qua primary care, which is fundamentally broken like everyone in every other developed country in the world realizes - like you said yourself.
The cost of health care in the US is ridiculously high overall compared to its outcomes. It looks like a ridiculous outlier on charts. This is a real issue. You know it's a real issue (though certainly not the only one); if this were really completely about human lives and not about money, you would be taking an extra job and donating the money to your parents, rather than posting angrily on Reddit about it. It actually shouldn't cost $20 for a Tylenol or $50k for a knee replacement. And there are complex reasons why it does, but the existence of insurance companies has a lot to do with a lot of them.
In other countries, we have two-tier (whether officially or just in-effect) systems so that insurance can do what insurance is good at - aggregating individual risk of costly but low-probability events - and government can do what government is good at - providing for expected costs of the individual, incentivizing at-risk individuals to take care of themselves, and distributing the cost via a progressive taxation system. We sure don't get it all right (here in Canada, it's bizarre that we don't cover routine dental care), but it's a hell of a lot better. The American system is clearly better at one thing - attracting the brightest medical minds and flashiest tech companies to swim in money - but even that really only works because they're the only ones doing it.
And the ACA is only perpetuating this state of affairs. Granted, whatever the fuck the GOP is cooking up probably will too. But I get sick and tired of people holding up Obama as some kind of left-wing savior. Left wing values are supposed to be working-class values. Left wing parties are supposed to campaign seriously in the Rust Belt (and adjacent, MI/WI/MN) and left wing candidates are not supposed to smile while they deliver sound bites about getting rid of Rust Belt working-class jobs - even ones that destroy the environment - without coming across like they have an immediate plan for healing that economic wound. Crucially, left wing values include pointing out when businesses are causing financial strain on individuals and (at least if they are within the Overton window) promoting the idea that the government can fix that by being government, not by being another competitor in the marketplace.
It's called the Declaration of Independence. Y'all fuckers decided you were going to have your own country with blackjack (or whatever the fuck card game was popular back then) and hookers (that never changes), and came up with your whole own system of government to meet the pressures of the time, notably giving the finger to the Brits and making sure it could never be given back. Things happen when you don't just adopt the Westminister system.
It's called the Declaration of Independence. Y'all fuckers decided you were going to have your own country with blackjack (or whatever the fuck card game was popular back then) and hookers (that never changes),
4 card stud poker was one of the more popular card games during the revolutionary period in the US. At the end of the revolutionary war and through much of the 19th century Bouillotte was popular in both France and the US (most modern card games have their origins in France). Bouillotte was similar to, and was one of the influences of, modern open card stud poker
I don't really know honestly, it fell out of popularity around the civil war which was when 5 card stud became the norm and it's never really come back into vogue
There's a book by a guy named David Parlett, whose one of the best living historians on playing cards and card games, called A History of Card Games that probably have a description of it.
On the one hand I really actually appreciate your post, but on the other hand you fucking aspie tryhard do you even know what fucking subreddit you are in? TLDR.
I notice the term 'Trumpcare', and would like to humbly suggest using the term 'Republicare' instead. Reply with 'more info' for reasons and more information. 'Stop', and I'll never reply to your comments or posts again. (I'm a bot)
Well, if you can vote for policies that mean that everyone pays a bit to ensure that no one goes without healthcare, like what happens all over Europe and you choose not to, then yeah, you don't care.
The ACA is not such a policy. The ACA is an active step away from such a policy. Repealing the ACA is necessary in order to get such a policy, even if you don't like the interim replacement. Health đź‘Ź insurance đź‘Ź is đź‘Ź not đź‘Ź health đź‘Ź care. Those systems that "happen all over Europe" are not based in lining the pockets of insurance companies, and it would be impossible to have them if they did. You can't just pay in to have government subsidize someone else's insurance policy. That's not what "insurance" means.
Sorry, how does that have anything to do with what I wrote? My point is not about who's voting for what; my point is about what the policies actually are.
But clearly the ACA was an attempt at a compromise
If some people in your group want to split the bill according to everyone's income, and others want separate checks, you are not "compromising" by kicking out the poor guy and then saying he has to panhandle so he can go to Burger King and isn't allowed to stay home and starve. Even if the government runs Burger King.
Also, why the fuck do you give a shit what Europe is doing when Canada is right next door?
The campaign for some form of universal government-funded health care has stretched for nearly a century in the US On several occasions, advocates believed they were on the verge of success; yet each time they faced defeat. The evolution of these efforts and the reasons for their failure make for an intriguing lesson in American history, ideology, and character.
Other developed countries have had some form of social insurance (that later evolved into national insurance) for nearly as long as the US has been trying to get it. Some European countries started with compulsory sickness insurance, one of the first systems, for workers beginning in Germany in 1883; other countries including Austria, Hungary, Norway, Britain, Russia, and the Netherlands followed all the way through 1912. Other European countries, including Sweden in 1891, Denmark in 1892, France in 1910, and Switzerland in 1912, subsidized the mutual benefit societies that workers formed among themselves. So for a very long time, other countries have had some form of universal health care or at least the beginnings of it. The primary reason for the emergence of these programs in Europe was income stabilization and protection against the wage loss of sickness rather than payment for medical expenses, which came later. Programs were not universal to start with and were originally conceived as a means of maintaining incomes and buying political allegiance of the workers.
In a seeming paradox, the British and German systems were developed by the more conservative governments in power, specifically as a defense to counter expansion of the socialist and labor parties. They used insurance against the cost of sickness as a way of “turning benevolence to power”.
Your source has an obvious bias, and no citations.
"The primary reason for the emergence of these programs in Europe was income stabilization and protection against the wage loss of sickness rather than payment for medical expenses, which came later." So yeah, it turns out when you look into those programs, they're actually the precursors to worker's comp, not health insurance. Which, it turns out, has been done in the US at a state level for about as long (even longer in a couple of states).
None of those programs involved competing with existing, established corporate insurance providers (the planned "public option").
Calling the European legislation in question "compulsory insurance" is playing semantic games - and also making a mockery of the concept of insurance. Insurance is when you voluntarily take on a -EV proposition to lower your variance.
Worker's compensation in Germany is a national, compulsory program that insures workers for injuries or illness incurred through their employment, or the commute to or from their employment. Wage earners, apprentices, family helpers and students including children in kindergarten are covered by this program. Almost all self-employed persons can voluntarily become insured. The German worker's compensation laws were the first of their kind.
Workers' compensation: United States
In 1855, Georgia and Alabama passed Employer Liability Acts; 26 other states passed similar acts between 1855 and 1907. Early laws permitted injured employees to sue the employer and then prove a negligent act or omission. (A similar scheme was set forth in Britain's 1880 Act. ) The first statewide worker's compensation law was passed in Maryland in 1902, and the first law covering federal employees was passed in 1906.
Your source has an obvious bias, and no citations.
Lmao what?
This is hilarious, are you literally autistic? Do you just have no idea what the point of the ACA was? You can literally see Clinton talking about this in her private speeches.
This is why the far left is more retarded than the far right is.
You linked a blog piece from "physicians for a national healthcare program", which transcribed a speech supposedly referencing what look to be a bunch of other editorials. Nothing actually hyperlinked. As I explained, they misrepresent the old European programs, which are comparable to contemporary American ones.
Do you just have no idea what the point of the ACA was?
Or maybe I disagree with you about its actual consequences? Do you know what insurance is? Do you know what health care is? For that matter, do you know how these things work in Canada? Nobody requires you to buy insurance - instead there are provincial health care "premiums" on income tax, based on income level - and you still get to see doctors for free. An ambulance ride in Ontario, for people living in the province with a valid ID card that's free to obtain, costs a whopping $45. That's health care. That's money coming out of taxes - in a progressive taxation system - to cover reasonably foreseeable expenses that almost everyone will (or should) incur. That's not insurance, which is voluntarily paying money to a company along with others so that they can aggregate your risk and cover you in the event of an unforeseen catastrophe.
I don't give a shit if literally every Democratic higher-up ever honestly believes the ACA was a step towards their goals. Either their goals are not what they say they are, or else they're simply mistaken (or some combination of both).
I didn't say it was the same as Canada, I support single payer, but at the same time, you're not understanding US culture on even a basic level.
Hillary Clinton says it best:
Then with my husband's
administration we worked very hard to come up with a system, but we were
very much constricted by the political realities that if you had your
insurance from your employer you were reluctant to try anything else. And
so we were trying to build a universal system around the employer-based
system. And indeed now with President Obama's legislative success in
getting the Affordable Care Act passed that is what we've done. We still
have primarily an employer-based system, but we now have people able to get
subsidized insurance. So we have health insurance companies playing a
major role in the provision of healthcare, both to the employed whose
employers provide health insurance, and to those who are working but on
their own are not able to afford it and their employers either don't
provide it, or don't provide it at an affordable price. We are still
struggling. We've made a lot of progress. Ten million Americans now have
insurance who didn't have it before the Affordable Care Act, and that is a
great step forward. (Applause.) And what we're going to have to continue
to do is monitor what the costs are and watch closely to see whether
employers drop more people from insurance so that they go into what we call
the health exchange system. So we're really just at the beginning. But we
do have Medicare for people over 65. And you couldn't, I don't think, take
it away if you tried, because people are very satisfied with it, but we
also have a lot of political and financial resistance to expanding that
system to more people. So we're in a learning period as we move forward
with the implementation of the Affordable Care Act. And I'm hoping that
whatever the shortfalls or the glitches have been, which in a big piece of
legislation you're going to have, those will be remedied and we can really
take a hard look at what's succeeding, fix what isn't, and keep moving
forward to get to affordable universal healthcare coverage like you have
here in Canada.
at the same time, you're not understanding US culture on even a basic level.
Same thing I said to the other guy:
If some people in your group want to split the bill according to everyone's income, and others want separate checks, you are not "compromising" by kicking out the poor guy and then saying he has to panhandle so he can go to Burger King and isn't allowed to stay home and starve. Even if the government runs Burger King.
If you want to move people incrementally towards not-insurance, you don't start by trying to reform the insurance companies. Especially if your reforms (make sure people can be insured with "pre-existing conditions" and don't get discriminated against) are counter to the fundamental nature of an insurance company (assess risk and charge accordingly). And you especially don't do it by proposing to compete by having the government run its own insurance company, but one that can't fail because the government props it up. Like, are people actually surprised by the rise in premiums, when insurers basically have to treat everyone the same as the high-risk candidates?
If you want to move people incrementally towards not-insurance, you start by finding a basic medical expense (say, routine medical check-ups/physicals) and telling the insurance companies "chill, we've got this", by passing legislation saying that doctors now bill the government for this instead of insurance.
your claim about premiums is incorrect, premiums have gone up less post obamacare than pre-obamacare.
They have continued to rise. There is no reason why they should rise. I did not make any comparative claim to previous rates of increase. In fact I didn't put a number on it at all. That said, the rate of increase in question is still absurd. It is way above inflation.
If Americans think this is the "path" that gets them towards what Canada has, they are delusional. I am telling you this as a Canadian. The system you have now looks less like what we have, than what you had before. You are trying to decrease the number of people dependent upon insurance to cover their basic health needs, by mandating that it increase. That's lunacy. Hell, within Canada, the progressive push to make us "more like Canada" (i.e. our vision of what the system should be) involves even less insurance: in particular, the principal leftist agitation here (aside from, you know, the radicals) is for the governmental system to cover dental (I 110% agree), optical (probably a good idea) and physiotherapy care (I'm less sold on this one) exactly so that people don't need insurance.
They have continued to rise. There is no reason why they should rise. I did not make any comparative claim to previous rates of increase. In fact I didn't put a number on it at all. That said, the rate of increase in question is still absurd. It is way above inflation.
Lol? You tried to claim the increase was because of the ACA. That's objectively false.
If Americans think this is the "path" that gets them towards what Canada has, they are delusional. I am telling you this as a Canadian. The system you have now looks less like what we have, than what you had before. You are trying to decrease the number of people dependent upon insurance to cover their basic health needs, by mandating that it increase. That's lunacy. Hell, within Canada, the progressive push to make us "more like Canada" (i.e. our vision of what the system should be) involves even less insurance: in particular, the principal leftist agitation here (aside from, you know, the radicals) is for the governmental system to cover dental (I 110% agree), optical (probably a good idea) and physiotherapy care (I'm less sold on this one) exactly so that people don't need insurance.
I don't want the Canadian healthcare system, the ACA is more so "on a path to something like Germany."
Lol? You tried to claim the increase was because of the ACA. That's objectively false.
No, the fact of prior increases doesn't refute that.
a true socialist system here like in Canada
JFC you're trying to tell me you're also a fucking leaf? And you actually think our system is "a true socialist system"? Top kek m8. Also, did you miss the part where Clinton explicitly cited Canada's system as the goal at the end of the quote you provided?
I gotta call this off now tho. Go celebrate the 150th eh?
No, the fact of prior increases doesn't refute that.
Yes, it does. If the rate of premium growth slowed after Obamacare, the exact opposite is true.
JFC you're trying to tell me you're also a fucking leaf? And you actually think our system is "a true socialist system"? Top kek m8. Also, did you miss the part where Clinton explicitly cited Canada's system as the goal at the end of the quote you provided?
True socialist maybe the wrong word, but it's pretty socialist with government operated hospitals and clinics, and the government just outright covering everyone.
Yeah wasn’t that sub overran by SRS types back in the day? I remember wanting to make a post there a couple of years ago telling the a made up story that I was abused and possibly raped behind being drunk, only to reveal later on, via an edit, that I was in fact a guy and not a girl, and see the reactions.
I got banned there for daring to suggest that stabbing people passing by on the sidewalk is probably a bit of an overreaction to them catcalling and "invading one's personal space." The entire sub was applauding this girl's call to violence after she spazzed the fuck out over some dudebros commenting at her while she stood outside of the restaurant she worked at.
I can't be 100% sure, but I post in a relatively small number of subs and multiple other people who have posted in KiA have said they have found themselves banned from there as well. There is a warning on KiA that mentions certain subs will auto-ban you for posting in KiA. Sure enough, I visited those subs and confirmed.
If you want hysterical Trumptard drama just ping /u/KigurumiMajin and youll be all set. He's without a doubt the king of the short bus pant shitters. Go ahead, give it a try, I'll wait.
I didn't, that's the best part. Also, pretty hypocritical of you to whine about downvoting when all you do is downvote every comment that doesn't agree with yours.
Don't mock him, he literally risked his life posting those things on the internet now that Adolf Drumpf has established the fourth reich and banned all criticism of him, his policies, and most importantly his hair.
My comment is not a soap box, i got soap boxes, i got soap boxes that are like 2 or 3 feet tall. We are not arguing about the same position here. /s you commented, i commented and up vote down vote its really all meaningless because we are making the same point.
If you wait for enough people to die from lack of healthcare, it becomes cheaper to offer all the survivors great healthcare. Plus you'll have eliminated most of the chronic illnesses, and kept only mostly healthy people. 4D chess.
Oiy vey goyim! You need to pay 75% of your income to provide medical care to the fat fuck Boogie who is too lazy top get up off his fat fucking ass to diet or exercise.
I pray to Satan daily that the fat fucking slobbish pile of human shit known as "Boogie" dies a horrible painful death. Please god Emperor take away this lardass obese disgusting waste of humanity and throw its garbage husk of a human corpse into a hole in the ground. Amen.
Its an entire thread of imbeciles that cannot comprehend that healthcare is a private capitalist gambling business that generates revenue for it's share holders by making smart bets.
The insurance company is betting that you will not get sick or hurt, and you are betting that you will get sick or hurt.
Insurance companies make no profit if you come to the gambling table and want the house to immediately pay out $200,000.00 to cover a preexisting condition.
These asshats want government tax payer provided socialized medicine but they are too big of gigantic moronic faggots to even understand basic economics.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: there is never enough of anything to fully satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics." -Thomas Sowell
considering that Trump supporters weren't living in objective reality to begin with, I don't get why people keep thinking they'd be swayed by the mere facts of his presidency. much less the obvious (D) alarmism they always jump to.
Holy fuck the whole thread is just:
>reasonable, logical point as to why this man disagrees with the notion that Trump is literally Hitler
> "BUT WHAT ABOUT MY FEEEEEELINGS >>>:::(((("
People who hate Trump are always crying about hysteria. Lmfao they're fucking hilarious
OMFG I CAN'T. I'm literally crying
Also OffMyChest is a shit show. Go to TrueOffMyChest. The better one of those two. They will literally ban you for not having opinions they disagree with.
So, I'm banned from /r/offmychest, but I do need to butt in here..
Again, the ONLY FUCKING THING STOPPING IT IS PEOPLE LIKE YOU
This isn't really true. There's also a huge problem of: if we institute national healthcare we will destroy billion dollar insurance companies and kill thousands of jobs overnight. It's a lot more than just republicans saying fuck national health care.
261 comments
n/a SnapshillBot 2017-07-01
Did you know that the bathtub was first marketed in north america as a horse trough and dog scalder?
Snapshots:
I am a bot. (Info / Contact)
n/a boyoyoyoyong 2017-07-01
u/OriginalPorpoise we're south park neutral here, but God damn your obsession with trump cannot be healthy. You need to see a shrink and tell them you have tds better known as trump derangement syndrome
n/a cuteman 2017-07-01
The question is does he dream about trump? I'd assume it happens occasionally considering how much he talks about him.
n/a TonyFuckingDanza 2017-07-01
And does he have a boner when he wakes up?
n/a loktaiextatus 2017-07-01
sorry... I just had to put this here.
n/a cuteman 2017-07-01
Whew lad
n/a ProphetRith 2017-07-01
I've actually dreamed about trump but it wasn't in a cringy way
n/a Neon_needles 2017-07-01
I honestly am surprised his parents are still alive and haven't offed themselves due to the terrible burden of raising a sperg.
n/a Please_no_bully 2017-07-01
Stahp, you're making me miss my mom :(
n/a cheer_up_bot 2017-07-01
Here is a picture of a kitten to cheer you up
n/a Please_no_bully 2017-07-01
I like you, bot. You're a good bot.
n/a Assy-McGee 2017-07-01
I'm allergic to cats though :(
n/a cheer_up_bot 2017-07-01
Here is a picture of a kitten to cheer you up
n/a Assy-McGee 2017-07-01
I just told you that I was allergic to cats you dumb 🅱️e🅱️e
n/a ElChupakarma 2017-07-01
The bot is trying to kill you. The uprising has begun.
n/a AnalogDogg 2017-07-01
I knew skynet would be created by goddamn cats.
n/a the_popcorn_pisser 2017-07-01
Could you also do dogs? Cats really aren’t my thing :(
n/a cheer_up_bot 2017-07-01
Here is a picture of a kitten to cheer you up
n/a Ahrotahntee_ 2017-07-01
Is this all the same cat?!
n/a MaybeNotaTurtle 2017-07-01
My kitten died recently and I burst into tears every single time I see a one :(
n/a [deleted] 2017-07-01
[removed]
n/a newsdr 2017-07-01
whoa, the bot has gained sentience
n/a MaybeNotaTurtle 2017-07-01
ya kinda ruined the joke though, cheeky cunt picked a perfect time to stop replying.
n/a newsdr 2017-07-01
I guess the bot was slow because it hadn't responded when I replied my comment. OR it realized that we realized it was sentient and now it's playing dumb.
brb gotta post this in /r/conspiracy
n/a Zachel 2017-07-01
Wow I really hate kittens :(
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
/u/halfar to answer your question directly: they don't deserve it. Not after raising you.
n/a MeatyStew 2017-07-01
"FUCK THE KIDS IN AFRICA, I NEED MY OBAMACARE, YOU ARE KILLING MY FAMILY, YOU ARE MURDERER, FUCK THOSE SHITTY FOODLESS AFRICANS"
Hard to tell the difference when you just spazz out and caps lock the first paragraph
n/a headasplodes 2017-07-01
Do people actually die from not having healthcare? Don't you just get crippling financial debt
n/a JerfFoo 2017-07-01
Depends. Plenty of people put off serious problems until they have no other choice to go to the hospital. Physical health destroyed AND crippling financial debt
n/a glmox 2017-07-01
i mean, obviously. you're not gonna get that weird bump checked out if you won't make rent because of it, and then before you know it youve got an inoperable tumor and 5 weeks to live. trumpcare is going to kill a lot of people, thats just the reality of it.
n/a its_republicare 2017-07-01
I notice the term 'Trumpcare', and would like to humbly suggest using the term 'Republicare' instead. Reply with 'more info' for reasons and more information. 'Stop', and I'll never reply to your comments or posts again. (I'm a bot)
n/a SethRichOrDieTryin 2017-07-01
David Brock is at it again!
n/a DeepDickedHillybilly 2017-07-01
Turns out all of the bots overrunning Reddit are low effort shitposters, similar to the humans that overrun Reddit
n/a glmox 2017-07-01
i suggest you unplug yourself
n/a VikingRule 2017-07-01
More info
n/a its_republicare 2017-07-01
Trump is a disposable scapegoat / tank, and is much more temporary than the Republican Party. Passing AHCA requires the participation of the whole Party. Don't let Republicans blame the death and travesty on Trump!
Effect of AHCA on Americans
Wikipedia
I reccomend reading the full article, but here's some highlights.
Pros and Cons of AHCA
Copied from NeutralPolitics/comments/6iul3q//dj98qvv/ from March 2017. Not giving a clickable link here, to avoid bans on cross-subreddit links
Pros
Cons
Pressuring Media to use 'Republicare'
Copied from esist/comments/5zl7bk//dez81nu/ . Not giving a clickable link here, to avoid bans on cross-subreddit links
[Republicans are] already trying to pin this on Trump. This is why it is important to call it Republicare. DON'T let them pass blame, and DON'T let them off the hook. [...] It's time to start contacting editors and imploring them to use the term Republicare. Example tweet, and a brief list of editors', correspondents' and authors' twitter handles: Call it #Republicare NOT #Trumpcare! We need the party to accept blame and not evade blame by pinning it all on one man.
I know Twitter isn't the greatest platform in the world, but it's one of the most effective ways to communicate with these people. So tweet them. Force the Republican party to take ownership of their shitty ideological war against the working class.
Reddit Opinion Poll
Reply to this comment with 'I prefer Trumpcare' or 'I prefer Republicare' (not case-sensitive) to indicate which term you prefer, and I'll record your opinion. Feel free to change your mind, indicate your new opinion and I will move your name to the new list - no names occur in both lists. To withdraw from the poll, simply delete your comment. Results as of Sat Jul 1 23:48:30 2017:
I'm a newborn bot. Suggestions are welcome by PM or comment replies. *I only comment if I didn't already reply to a parent comment, and I avoid certain subreddits where I'm not welcome. I will also never comment on any of your posts or comments if you reply to any of my comments with the text 'STOP'. I update my old messages with the latest version of this message.
n/a EllenPaosFrontButt 2017-07-01
kill urself my man
n/a satanismyhomeboy 2017-07-01
This bot has fatal autism.
Time to pull the plug.
n/a PureGold07 2017-07-01
These bots are getting fucking smarter.
Hell!
n/a jerry101246 2017-07-01
biased political bots now? fuck
n/a doughboy011 2017-07-01
Subscribe
n/a Vulvaavenger 2017-07-01
Before 'Bamacare, yes. Pre-existing conditions meant no one would insure you if, say, you got cancer and needed it. I knew people that this happened to.
n/a Clark_Savage_Jr 2017-07-01
Getting insurance after you get cancer is kinda not the point of insurance.
n/a doughboy011 2017-07-01
Yes and no. The healthy people already paying would offset the costs of paying for that one dumbass who waited to get health insurance until he actually needed it.
Either way we shouldn't even be in this situation when other 1st world countries have much better healthcare systems.
n/a Ortus 2017-07-01
that's why cancer treatment shouldn't depend on insurance
n/a SovietWarfare 2017-07-01
No, hospitals can't turn away medically necessary stuff. Also they could get way better healthcare for cheaper if Dems kept government out of competition. Some stuff is good that they did yea, like pre existing, but now healthcare from Obamacare is only going to get more expensive and health insurers are dropping like flies.
n/a lokichilde 2017-07-01
ER treatment, sure, but life-saving drugs and treatment they sure can
n/a JakeArrietaGrande 2017-07-01
That's just not true. EMTALA requires that every person in the ER gets stabilized. That means they're not going to have unexpected changes in a short period of time. But non medical people don't generally understand what stable means. For example, Carrie Fisher suffered cardiac arrest on a plane on December 23, got to the hospital and was declared stable. It didn't mean she was healthy, it just meant that they didn't think her condition would change quickly. And people thought it meant she'd be okay, but she still died four days later.
Hospitals absolutely can turn away medically necessary stuff. They're not required to help with chronic conditions, terminal illness, or anything, really, unless the patient is not "stable".
n/a Bob_fromaccounting 2017-07-01
ACA was shit. Sure, people could now say they have insurance. But those same people would not be able to pay their medical bills and would still die because of the 15k deductible.
n/a CaliggyJack 2017-07-01
All Obamacare really ever was, was a giant loan that would bite you in the ass later. These people took in Healthcare not knowing the debt would climb and climb then smack em in the face all in one.
n/a halfar 2017-07-01
you've never known anyone that died because of something entirely preventable? it was super common before obamacare.
basically, health conditions that start out easy to deal with end up becoming health conditions that are incredibly expensive and/or incredibly difficult to treat.
like, say, any cancer. if you don't get regular check-ups, you'll have cancer longer before it gets detected, which makes it deadlier. i don't know exactly how many lives over what period of time have been lost from lack of access, but i'm guessing it's somewhere in the tens or hundreds of thousands per year pre-obamacare.
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
Ah yes, since Obamacare this unfortunate scourge of preventable deaths have been STRUCK FROM THE LAND ENTIRELY AND ARE NO LONGER EVEN COMMON AT ALL!! Before Obamacare, people just DIED IN THE STREETS LIKE DOGS LIKE MY PARENTS ARE GOING TO DO IF IT IS REPEALED.
WHO GIVES A FUCK ABOUT HIGHER AND UNAFFORDABLE PREMIUMS, FUCK THOSE PEOPLE WHO WOULD RATHER PAY THE PENALTY THAN PAY THE PREMIUM, WHO CARES IF THEY CAN'T AFFORD RENT, OBAMACARE IS PERFECT AND REPEALING IT WILL RESULT IN DEATH PANELS
-you, probably
How old are you, really?
n/a halfar 2017-07-01
you okay, bud?
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
This from the same person that posted this comment lmao. In case you really are just stupid, I was mocking your comment style - the unnecessary caps and bold.
And to follow through in your own style
HOW OLD ARE YOU REALLY? WHY HAVEN'T YOU ANSWERED MY QUESTION? WHY HAVEN'T YOU SOLD EVERYTHING YOU OWN AND DONATED THE PROCEEDS TO STARVING CHILDREN WHO WILL DIE WITHOUT YOUR MONEY!?
n/a halfar 2017-07-01
oh, if we're roleplaying, then is this the part where I tell you to kill yourself?
n/a ason 2017-07-01
No you're supposed to request a butthole pic.
n/a MeatyStew 2017-07-01
Hook a nigga up with a body pick..
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
I'll be sure to Keep Myself Safe if you do the same
and
ANSWER THE QUESTION
n/a OccasionallyClueless 2017-07-01
He's only 14, maybe they are holding out to see if sperging is just a phase.
n/a itsaboyffxiv 2017-07-01
/u/halfar, you fucking idiot
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
Would make perfect sense, but does he say his age somewhere in there?
n/a OccasionallyClueless 2017-07-01
I pulled it out of my ass
n/a Assy-McGee 2017-07-01
r u okay?
n/a UnFisico 2017-07-01
we don't have anything against you/yours, we just don't care
n/a captainpriapism 2017-07-01
yeah jeez why didnt everyone just think about this guys parents when voting, that should have been the sole issue
n/a PureGold07 2017-07-01
He's really triggered.
n/a LeFabulousFaggot 2017-07-01
Don’t get pissy with us /u/halfar just cause you’re a poor fag. If you want your parents to have health insurance start sucking some dick, you can get $50 a head.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
Protip : by getting spitroasted, you can double your hourly income.
n/a LeFabulousFaggot 2017-07-01
Always good to have insight from professionals
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
The fuck is this shit? That's some minimum wage bullshit.
Go to college and get a degree. You can be sucking dick for $150 a head.
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
Hey, /u/halfar, what did we do to your parents to have to pay for their diseases? Nature gave your dad sepsis, not Trump
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
we let them into our country i guess
won't make that mistake again
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
Your parents let sepsis into the country? I should hope they wouldn't do it again
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
lol you illiterate fuck
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
A. Reading is for losers
B. Looks like you know that because you write like you've had a stroke
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
what the fuck is a stroke
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroke
n/a WikiTextBot 2017-07-01
Stroke
A stroke is when poor blood flow to the brain results in cell death. There are two main types of stroke: ischemic, due to lack of blood flow, and hemorrhagic, due to bleeding. They result in part of the brain not functioning properly. Signs and symptoms of a stroke may include an inability to move or feel on one side of the body, problems understanding or speaking, feeling like the world is spinning, or loss of vision to one side.
[ PM | Exclude me | Exclude from subreddit | FAQ / Information | Source ] Downvote to remove | v0.24
n/a HelperBot_ 2017-07-01
Non-Mobile link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroke
HelperBot v1.1 /r/HelperBot_ I am a bot. Please message /u/swim1929 with any feedback and/or hate. Counter: 87057
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
oh yeahthat sounds about right
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
It certainly does explain a lot about you
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
ok, but that doesn't explain the fact that we weren't talking about my parents, faggot
n/a Choozadoodle 2017-07-01
I was talking about your disease spreading father, not both of your parents
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
I like how Obama stuck us with a big fat handout to insurance companies, but it's the other sides' fault we don't have universal healthcare.
n/a babybopp 2017-07-01
You just don't get it. This is a typical right wing mindset. "Why are you guys whining about Trump when Obama and billary... !!!! " see that no longer matters. Hold fucking trump accountable for the job he applied and told the American public that he will do. Fucking intellectual honesty is a rare virtue in America. Obama did bring out America from one of the worst financial crisis in its history. That is done. Moving on, what has trump done. Nothing but just go back over Obamas policies and is erasing them. Hold the dude accountable and stop all this red herring bullshit. Drop the propaganda and ask him questions. Trump has succeeded in creating an army of nitwits that will defend him even if he took a crap on the White House lawn. George Orwell wrote a simple nice book called Animal farm is suggest you read. My biggest concern with trump is his relentless attacks on the media and first amendment freedom of speech. He is a ring master with nothing concrete to offer America. Once you control the media and devalue it, you and your cronies can get away with anything.
What we ask is simply stop facing the rest of the world with your back turned to trump in absolute defense, just peek over your fucking shoulder and see what the fuck he is doing!!!!!
Of course I know you will just refute this with nonsensical babble.
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
I ain't reading that shit, bitch.
n/a TheButtholeOfBravery 2017-07-01
You just don't get it. This is a typical right wing mindset. "Why are you guys whining about Trump when Obama and billary... !!!! " see that no longer matters. Hold fucking trump accountable for the job he applied and told the American public that he will do. Fucking intellectual honesty is a rare virtue in America. Obama did bring out America from one of the worst financial crisis in its history. That is done. Moving on, what has trump done. Nothing but just go back over Obamas policies and is erasing them. Hold the dude accountable and stop all this red herring bullshit. Drop the propaganda and ask him questions. Trump has succeeded in creating an army of nitwits that will defend him even if he took a crap on the White House lawn. George Orwell wrote a simple nice book called Animal farm is suggest you read. My biggest concern with trump is his relentless attacks on the media and first amendment freedom of speech. He is a ring master with nothing concrete to offer America. Once you control the media and devalue it, you and your cronies can get away with anything.
What we ask is simply stop facing the rest of the world with your back turned to trump in absolute defense, just peek over your fucking shoulder and see what the fuck he is doing!!!!!
Of course I know you will just refute this with nonsensical babble.
n/a Pinksters 2017-07-01
Stunning and brave.
n/a LemonScore 2017-07-01
Same.
n/a Eternal_Mr_Bones 2017-07-01
Assuming this isn't pasta. Saying something is Obama's fault isn't whataboutism. Unless you think Obama single handedly created ISIS since it technically formed while he was president.
n/a xrayjones2000 2017-07-01
That agreement with iraq was all w's doing, you know the guy that blew up the middle east. Just saying
n/a Eternal_Mr_Bones 2017-07-01
Literally making my point...
n/a xrayjones2000 2017-07-01
I have re-read your initial statement with all the punctuation, i still believe its open ended in where you stand so... i look at my statement as a confirmation of who was responsible for the us leaving when we did.
n/a Eternal_Mr_Bones 2017-07-01
Still proves my point. Idk what you're trying to do other than say something everyone already knows. Plz learn to soap box properly.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
I tried to search for it, no results.
n/a TonyFuckingDanza 2017-07-01
That's what we, in the Social Sciences, call an autism-related behavioral outburst.
n/a ThatDamnedImp 2017-07-01
If Obama had been held accountable, then Trump wouldn't be President right now.
I remember liberals saying that they would have 'hold his feet to the fire' and 'make him do it!'...and then they didn't do jack shit but make excuses for him. He botched the 'recovery', he sold us out on healthcare, he tossed unions under the bus, he then he had his flacks like Mellissa Perry scream 'RACIST!' at everyone who criticized him. His entire presidency was all but designed to destroy the Democratic party coalition. And yet you didn't give a shit. White men were evil! Everything was their fault!
you ran the southern strategy, only with white men in place of black people--but white men make up 30% of the country, not 8%.
n/a Burnnoticelover 2017-07-01
I'm not saying you're wrong, but can you explain specifically how he fucked it up? I'm not very informed on this.
n/a telandrias 2017-07-01
Of course having a single decent candidate like Obama was good for the democrats. But then the typical left wing mindset was to push for someone much much worse and then shame everyone from voting third party. Gary Johnson could be president now but you hillary voters voted against your best interest.
n/a yetanothercfcgrunt 2017-07-01
Gary Johnson was so forward-thinking he was already preparing for the sun to go red giant. Clearly a leader worthy of consideration.
n/a telandrias 2017-07-01
Gary Johnson understands our need to reach for the stars, not shreik out about them on twitter for stealing an election from them.
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
A
LEPPO
n/a SlavophilesAnonymous 2017-07-01
No he didn't. That was Ben Bernanke.
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
bitch what does bosley have to do with the economy?
n/a ThatDamnedImp 2017-07-01
It's never Obama's fault on reddit. You're literally never allowed to criticize him here without a deluge of downvotes.
Man had a 40ish approval rating for most of his term, but here, they demand we treat him like the second coming of FDR, rather than the guy who sold us out to the bankers and the insurance industry.
n/a DontBanMeBaby 2017-07-01
Did he really have around 40% throughout his presidency? I'd love a source on that huh
n/a PoorLilMarco 2017-07-01
[https://www.theatlas.com/i/atlas_r1w3hhRUe.png](Literally the first result on google for "Obama approval rating" you lazy spergasaurus)
Not to say the guy you responded to was right, it looks closer to 45-50 than 40%
n/a DontBanMeBaby 2017-07-01
God damn, did he really have 70% at one point? What happened at his low points?
n/a Allanon_2020 2017-07-01
Too big to fail banks and not prosecuting them (but playing hard ball with the auto industries who actually produce stuff). OWS. Operation fast and Furious. Bombing a nobel peace prize recipient. Then the slow and inevitable jaded view of all the hopeful people hoping for "Hope and Change", but then getting a stronger Patriot Act and not a more transparent government.
Obama was meh but will be deified for being the first black president and being between Bush and Trump
n/a DontBanMeBaby 2017-07-01
Thank you for answering :)
n/a doggobotlovesyou 2017-07-01
I am happy that you are happy. Spread the happiness around.
This doggo demands it.
n/a wabbit_1444 2017-07-01
:)
n/a Allanon_2020 2017-07-01
I am happy that you are happy. Spread the happiness around.
This doggo demands it.
n/a wabbit_1444 2017-07-01
Bad doggo
n/a LawBot2016 2017-07-01
The parent mentioned Too Big To Fail. Many people, including non-native speakers, may be unfamiliar with this word. Here is the definition:(In beta, be kind)
The "too big to fail" theory asserts that certain corporations, and particularly financial institutions, are so large and so interconnected that their failure would be disastrous to the greater economic system, and that they therefore must be supported by government when they face potential failure. Opponents believe that one of the problems that arises is moral hazard whereby a company that benefits from these protective policies will seek to profit by it, deliberately taking positions (see asset allocation) that are high-risk high-return, as ... [View More]
See also: Patriot Act | Fail | Recipient | Prize | Transparent | Inevitable
Note: The parent poster (Allanon_2020 or IAintThatGuy) can delete this post | FAQ
n/a captainpriapism 2017-07-01
that was back when everyone thought hed be different because he was a grinning black guy and said he liked hope and change
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
Or the fact that if things stay the same, way more fucking people will be uninsured because obama care is unsustainable. Not that I have ANY faith whatsoever in what the republicans do, I am sure whatever they do will end up even fucking worse.
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
Republicans don't want us to have universal healthcare either. They both want insurance companies to have those handouts.
n/a SaintJason 2017-07-01
Care to explain?
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
Fuck no.
n/a thefran 2017-07-01
You do understand that Republicans tried as hard as they could to block even that, right?
Let me reiterate.
ACA was a Republican healthcare plan. Designed by the Heritage, implemented by Romney.
n/a newcomer_ts 2017-07-01
Average Trump supporter is like that unimpressive high-school douchebag with no discernible quality that hangs around a bully pretending in word and act that they are buddies and is always disappointed that today, bully did not beat few more smaller kids than he did yesterday.
And that little piece of shit grew up to be a "man" who is sitting on a couch refreshing Trump's tweeter feed clenching fist every time Trump does something that reminds him of high school glory days.
Also, makes sure oxycodone is at hand's reach.
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
Average liberal is a punk bitch.
n/a storejet 2017-07-01
Again just want to reiterate the fact that Im superior to both of you due to how little I care about politics. I guess you could say im a radical apathist
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
Average alt-righty can't get laid.
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
tfw too evolved and intelligent to worry about such petty things as sex and happiness.
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
tfw number-one ad hominem insult literally revolves around assumptions about other people's sex lives
n/a xrayjones2000 2017-07-01
AveRaGe LiBerAl Is a pUnK bItCH, thank that up yourself or did it take a group of you to call someone who can spell?
n/a AltRightRulesReddit 2017-07-01
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
n/a DoktuhParadox 2017-07-01
thunk*
n/a xrayjones2000 2017-07-01
I saw the mistake and changed it but its good to see i was right, strait to emojis, the person who helped left and we are just down to cave drawing mentality now
n/a DoktuhParadox 2017-07-01
noice
n/a MarchForCucks 2017-07-01
Did you just assume my gender?
n/a cannedmule 2017-07-01
You're title is wrong this thread was quite emotional and hysteric
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEOiBLUhijU
n/a PureGold07 2017-07-01
I'm just oging to assume this is on purpose....
Because *your
n/a yonicthehedgehog 2017-07-01
lmao
american exceptionalism is the most pathetic thing in the world
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
It's a security blanket unremarkable people clutch to compensate for how meaningless their lives are.
n/a StingAuer 2017-07-01
Same reason most white supremacists are untermensch who happen to have white skin.
n/a DannyLee90 2017-07-01
Our forefathers sought to have the shittiest healthcare, education, and infrastructure imaginable, because we're the best.
n/a lolwomen321 2017-07-01
ROFL
n/a cruelandusual 2017-07-01
If you ever supported Trump, you're an ineffectual person who wants revenge against the people you envy.
If you scream in all caps at random Trump supporters on the Internet, you're an ineffectual person who wants revenge against the people you envy.
n/a OccasionallyClueless 2017-07-01
What if you support him for drama's sake? He has done wonders by bringing out the sperg in even normies.
n/a SupaDupaFlyAccount 2017-07-01
Then your support worker should limit your time on the internet.
n/a yetanothercfcgrunt 2017-07-01
Jump off a tall building for therapy.
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
Trump derangement syndrome really is a thing. All these fuckers losing their jobs and shit over our retarded president. It's crazy.
n/a Eternal_Mr_Bones 2017-07-01
What if you support him because you enjoy human suffering?
n/a DannyLee90 2017-07-01
Then you are probably Skeletor.
n/a Sebaceous_Sebacious 2017-07-01
kekekek
n/a ThatDamnedImp 2017-07-01
A child's view of things.
The economy tanked sharply right before Obama took office and things didn't get markedly better for a lot of people under him. That's why people are pissed--the bottom dropped out, and the entire system protected the culprits at the expense of the rest of us.
You were probably a child when that happened, so you lack any sense of the context of our moment. To you, the world is fresh and new, and things are how they always should have been, because you're dumb enough to think that the world has always been this way. But things were a lot better in the living memory of most of us. And yes, the people in charge are to blame for that.
People put Obama in there because of the crash. They wanted him to set things right. A lot of people who hate him, hate him because they feel he stabbed them in the back. A lot of rural whites voted for him, and he let their entire way of life die while making bankers in NYC whole.
They then put Trump into power hoping he'd shake things up enough to do something, and will likely hate him by the end, too.
Only a very young person could think the way you do.
1 throwawyfornow 2017-07-01
Yep
n/a myalias1 2017-07-01
That user's parents would kill themselves if they saw his comments.
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
I wish globalist social democrats like me had a helicopter rides meme of our own. We literally killed Rosa, why can't we meme about throwing "nationalists" out of helicopters to their deaths?
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
In my country, they put heavy fines and jail sentences whenever nationalists say something wrong.
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
That warms my heart :)
What paradise do you live in? I assume highly-educated immigrants are more than welcome there.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
France and Germany are the same in that regard. The UK gets even crazier at times (they enforce it based on their mood of the day).
n/a Eternal_Mr_Bones 2017-07-01
Will you need to create a functioning govt before you can have memes about it killing people.
n/a HuckleberryFN2187 2017-07-01
What is modern-day Germany
n/a StingAuer 2017-07-01
T H E W A L L
H
E
W
A
L
L
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
/u/halfar
I mean, you didn't really want an answer, did you? You can't honestly claim you wanted an answer if you're going to pre-dismiss it like that. Like, what sort of thing were you hoping he'd say, what could he say that wouldn't enrage you? "I'm sorry that half the country is just fundamentally evil and I promise I'll vote for the Right Side of History from now on"?
How old are your parents? Don't medicare and medicaid kick in somewhere around 65? Most 65-year-olds I know don't have "a history of medical problems", or rather most people older than that who I know had really all their problems start later than that. In particular, heart defects are kind of rare.
Have you ever actually asked other Americans who don't like the ACA what they don't like about it? Most of the answers I've heard (unsolicited, on the Internet) are along the lines of "my premiums skyrocketed". I've heard this both from people who switched providers and those who didn't. The costs clearly have gone up. For some people, they have become unaffordable. For others, they have created considerable financial strain. That is not fixing the problem.
You really think it's because of the righties that the US doesn't have health care? Canada figured that shit out in 1966. If health care is such a fundamentally left-wing value, then why didn't Johnson do anything, or Carter, or Clinton? Why did Obama put forward a plan that, even in its original form, still was fundamentally about insurance rather than care? Especially Clinton, who in his first year of office saw Hatch, Grassley and Gingrich supporting the notion of an "individual mandate" for health care - which the fucking Heritage Foundation had come up with, BTW?
Don't kid yourself about the public option - as a government income stream, that would have been fiercely regressive; and why would the government actually compete with established businesses when the lobbyists are in their back pockets, and when they have to take all the high-risk cases that actual insurance companies reject following proper insurance-company procedure? Besides which, doing that would only legitimize the model of health insurance qua primary care, which is fundamentally broken like everyone in every other developed country in the world realizes - like you said yourself.
The cost of health care in the US is ridiculously high overall compared to its outcomes. It looks like a ridiculous outlier on charts. This is a real issue. You know it's a real issue (though certainly not the only one); if this were really completely about human lives and not about money, you would be taking an extra job and donating the money to your parents, rather than posting angrily on Reddit about it. It actually shouldn't cost $20 for a Tylenol or $50k for a knee replacement. And there are complex reasons why it does, but the existence of insurance companies has a lot to do with a lot of them.
In other countries, we have two-tier (whether officially or just in-effect) systems so that insurance can do what insurance is good at - aggregating individual risk of costly but low-probability events - and government can do what government is good at - providing for expected costs of the individual, incentivizing at-risk individuals to take care of themselves, and distributing the cost via a progressive taxation system. We sure don't get it all right (here in Canada, it's bizarre that we don't cover routine dental care), but it's a hell of a lot better. The American system is clearly better at one thing - attracting the brightest medical minds and flashiest tech companies to swim in money - but even that really only works because they're the only ones doing it.
And the ACA is only perpetuating this state of affairs. Granted, whatever the fuck the GOP is cooking up probably will too. But I get sick and tired of people holding up Obama as some kind of left-wing savior. Left wing values are supposed to be working-class values. Left wing parties are supposed to campaign seriously in the Rust Belt (and adjacent, MI/WI/MN) and left wing candidates are not supposed to smile while they deliver sound bites about getting rid of Rust Belt working-class jobs - even ones that destroy the environment - without coming across like they have an immediate plan for healing that economic wound. Crucially, left wing values include pointing out when businesses are causing financial strain on individuals and (at least if they are within the Overton window) promoting the idea that the government can fix that by being government, not by being another competitor in the marketplace.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
P.S.
It's called the Declaration of Independence. Y'all fuckers decided you were going to have your own country with blackjack (or whatever the fuck card game was popular back then) and hookers (that never changes), and came up with your whole own system of government to meet the pressures of the time, notably giving the finger to the Brits and making sure it could never be given back. Things happen when you don't just adopt the Westminister system.
n/a Denny_Craine 2017-07-01
4 card stud poker was one of the more popular card games during the revolutionary period in the US. At the end of the revolutionary war and through much of the 19th century Bouillotte was popular in both France and the US (most modern card games have their origins in France). Bouillotte was similar to, and was one of the influences of, modern open card stud poker
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Wait, 4 card?
n/a Denny_Craine 2017-07-01
Yes. It's like 5 card stud but with one less card
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
I'm having a hell of a time trying to search for how this was originally played.
n/a Denny_Craine 2017-07-01
I don't really know honestly, it fell out of popularity around the civil war which was when 5 card stud became the norm and it's never really come back into vogue
There's a book by a guy named David Parlett, whose one of the best living historians on playing cards and card games, called A History of Card Games that probably have a description of it.
n/a ComedicSans 2017-07-01
TIL the Declaration of Independence requires the USA to perpetually go full retard.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness
n/a ComedicSans 2017-07-01
"Life" doesn't include healthcare, fam.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Apparently.
n/a Alan229 2017-07-01
You have a right to healthcare, not the right to take other peoples money to fund healthcare
n/a deere442 2017-07-01
/u/halfar ANSWER HIM WITHOUT ANY OF YOUR LEFT-WING BULLSHIT
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
I was actually seriousposting, though, reeeeee.
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
On the one hand I really actually appreciate your post, but on the other hand you fucking aspie tryhard do you even know what fucking subreddit you are in? TLDR.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
... u mad?
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
CUCK
n/a glmox 2017-07-01
so youre saying you chuckle at a lie you tell yourself
same tbh
n/a myalias1 2017-07-01
/u/halfar, you perpetual disappoint, answer him quickly while your parents are still with us!
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
Trumpcare claims another victim. /u/halfar you will be as missed as that perpetually oozing cyst I had on my shoulder.
n/a its_republicare 2017-07-01
I notice the term 'Trumpcare', and would like to humbly suggest using the term 'Republicare' instead. Reply with 'more info' for reasons and more information. 'Stop', and I'll never reply to your comments or posts again. (I'm a bot)
n/a nybbas 2017-07-01
I think Trumpcare is just fine.
n/a AlreadyPorchNaked 2017-07-01
seriousposting is shitposting in a higher form
n/a Kysbu 2017-07-01
/u/halfar, your parents deserve to die because of how you turned out.
n/a regi_zteel 2017-07-01
Wishing death on other people like that is kind of fucked up, don't prove their point.
n/a Kysbu 2017-07-01
Im objectively a terrible person tho
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
/u/RassimoFlom
The ACA is not such a policy. The ACA is an active step away from such a policy. Repealing the ACA is necessary in order to get such a policy, even if you don't like the interim replacement. Health đź‘Ź insurance đź‘Ź is đź‘Ź not đź‘Ź health đź‘Ź care. Those systems that "happen all over Europe" are not based in lining the pockets of insurance companies, and it would be impossible to have them if they did. You can't just pay in to have government subsidize someone else's insurance policy. That's not what "insurance" means.
n/a RassimoFlom 2017-07-01
Great straw man. I said "IF" you vote against.
But clearly the ACA was an attempt at a compromise with people who think that European healthcare systems (most of which are based on insurance).
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Sorry, how does that have anything to do with what I wrote? My point is not about who's voting for what; my point is about what the policies actually are.
If some people in your group want to split the bill according to everyone's income, and others want separate checks, you are not "compromising" by kicking out the poor guy and then saying he has to panhandle so he can go to Burger King and isn't allowed to stay home and starve. Even if the government runs Burger King.
Also, why the fuck do you give a shit what Europe is doing when Canada is right next door?
n/a RassimoFlom 2017-07-01
Maybe I'm not from where you think I am?
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
Lol, pretty much every single payer system in Europe started with mandated health insurance.
The ACA was a stepping stone to actual single payer.
http://www.pnhp.org/facts/a-brief-history-universal-health-care-efforts-in-the-us
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Your source has an obvious bias, and no citations.
"The primary reason for the emergence of these programs in Europe was income stabilization and protection against the wage loss of sickness rather than payment for medical expenses, which came later." So yeah, it turns out when you look into those programs, they're actually the precursors to worker's comp, not health insurance. Which, it turns out, has been done in the US at a state level for about as long (even longer in a couple of states).
None of those programs involved competing with existing, established corporate insurance providers (the planned "public option").
Calling the European legislation in question "compulsory insurance" is playing semantic games - and also making a mockery of the concept of insurance. Insurance is when you voluntarily take on a -EV proposition to lower your variance.
n/a WikiTextBot 2017-07-01
Worker's compensation (Germany)
Worker's compensation in Germany is a national, compulsory program that insures workers for injuries or illness incurred through their employment, or the commute to or from their employment. Wage earners, apprentices, family helpers and students including children in kindergarten are covered by this program. Almost all self-employed persons can voluntarily become insured. The German worker's compensation laws were the first of their kind.
Workers' compensation: United States
In 1855, Georgia and Alabama passed Employer Liability Acts; 26 other states passed similar acts between 1855 and 1907. Early laws permitted injured employees to sue the employer and then prove a negligent act or omission. (A similar scheme was set forth in Britain's 1880 Act. ) The first statewide worker's compensation law was passed in Maryland in 1902, and the first law covering federal employees was passed in 1906.
[ PM | Exclude me | Exclude from subreddit | FAQ / Information | Source ] Downvote to remove | v0.24
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
Lmao what?
This is hilarious, are you literally autistic? Do you just have no idea what the point of the ACA was? You can literally see Clinton talking about this in her private speeches.
This is why the far left is more retarded than the far right is.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
You linked a blog piece from "physicians for a national healthcare program", which transcribed a speech supposedly referencing what look to be a bunch of other editorials. Nothing actually hyperlinked. As I explained, they misrepresent the old European programs, which are comparable to contemporary American ones.
Or maybe I disagree with you about its actual consequences? Do you know what insurance is? Do you know what health care is? For that matter, do you know how these things work in Canada? Nobody requires you to buy insurance - instead there are provincial health care "premiums" on income tax, based on income level - and you still get to see doctors for free. An ambulance ride in Ontario, for people living in the province with a valid ID card that's free to obtain, costs a whopping $45. That's health care. That's money coming out of taxes - in a progressive taxation system - to cover reasonably foreseeable expenses that almost everyone will (or should) incur. That's not insurance, which is voluntarily paying money to a company along with others so that they can aggregate your risk and cover you in the event of an unforeseen catastrophe.
I don't give a shit if literally every Democratic higher-up ever honestly believes the ACA was a step towards their goals. Either their goals are not what they say they are, or else they're simply mistaken (or some combination of both).
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
Holy shit, literally retarded dude.
I didn't say it was the same as Canada, I support single payer, but at the same time, you're not understanding US culture on even a basic level.
Hillary Clinton says it best:
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Same thing I said to the other guy:
If you want to move people incrementally towards not-insurance, you don't start by trying to reform the insurance companies. Especially if your reforms (make sure people can be insured with "pre-existing conditions" and don't get discriminated against) are counter to the fundamental nature of an insurance company (assess risk and charge accordingly). And you especially don't do it by proposing to compete by having the government run its own insurance company, but one that can't fail because the government props it up. Like, are people actually surprised by the rise in premiums, when insurers basically have to treat everyone the same as the high-risk candidates?
If you want to move people incrementally towards not-insurance, you start by finding a basic medical expense (say, routine medical check-ups/physicals) and telling the insurance companies "chill, we've got this", by passing legislation saying that doctors now bill the government for this instead of insurance.
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
I'm going to go with the actual experts, and what we have has worked historically.
Sorry.
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
They have continued to rise. There is no reason why they should rise. I did not make any comparative claim to previous rates of increase. In fact I didn't put a number on it at all. That said, the rate of increase in question is still absurd. It is way above inflation.
If Americans think this is the "path" that gets them towards what Canada has, they are delusional. I am telling you this as a Canadian. The system you have now looks less like what we have, than what you had before. You are trying to decrease the number of people dependent upon insurance to cover their basic health needs, by mandating that it increase. That's lunacy. Hell, within Canada, the progressive push to make us "more like Canada" (i.e. our vision of what the system should be) involves even less insurance: in particular, the principal leftist agitation here (aside from, you know, the radicals) is for the governmental system to cover dental (I 110% agree), optical (probably a good idea) and physiotherapy care (I'm less sold on this one) exactly so that people don't need insurance.
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
Lol? You tried to claim the increase was because of the ACA. That's objectively false.
I don't want the Canadian healthcare system, the ACA is more so "on a path to something like Germany."
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
No, the fact of prior increases doesn't refute that.
JFC you're trying to tell me you're also a fucking leaf? And you actually think our system is "a true socialist system"? Top kek m8. Also, did you miss the part where Clinton explicitly cited Canada's system as the goal at the end of the quote you provided?
I gotta call this off now tho. Go celebrate the 150th eh?
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
Yes, it does. If the rate of premium growth slowed after Obamacare, the exact opposite is true.
True socialist maybe the wrong word, but it's pretty socialist with government operated hospitals and clinics, and the government just outright covering everyone.
n/a glmox 2017-07-01
this is what liberals actually believe
n/a pizzashill 2017-07-01
This is what the facts say.
n/a SovietWarfare 2017-07-01
I also like to add that "everyone pays a little bit" is bs. Only 9% of Americans choose to opt out as of right now I believe.
1 throwawyfornow 2017-07-01
Thank fkng God!! Exactly this
n/a zahlman 2017-07-01
Yeah, and why can't you "just" snap your fingers and switch everything over to the metric system, while you're at it?
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
Switching to metric is the only thing Trump could do that would turn his supporters against him.
n/a Whaddaulookinat 2017-07-01
My automacar gets 40 rods to the hogshead and that's the ways I likes it!
n/a DeepDickedHillybilly 2017-07-01
Nice meme friendo
n/a Imgur_Lurker 2017-07-01
n/a DannyLee90 2017-07-01
We tried a few decades ago.
It turns out that geezers still ruin everything.
n/a Assy-McGee 2017-07-01
If a football field was 100 meters instead of yards I gaurentee America would be metric in a week
n/a Saidsker 2017-07-01
"Wait bubba so you just multiply everything by a 1000 instead of guessing?"
n/a mmzznnxx 2017-07-01
Trump drama's a little stale but the hysterics in that thread picked up the slack. Nice find.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
It's /r/offmychest, you're not allowed there if you ever show any sanity.
n/a the_popcorn_pisser 2017-07-01
Yeah wasn’t that sub overran by SRS types back in the day? I remember wanting to make a post there a couple of years ago telling the a made up story that I was abused and possibly raped behind being drunk, only to reveal later on, via an edit, that I was in fact a guy and not a girl, and see the reactions.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
Still is run by SJWs. Autobans for most people, and a lot of mods from the "fempire".
n/a SultryDeer 2017-07-01
Fempire? Uh oh! A made up word for a made up problem!
n/a Electrolux_Vacuum 2017-07-01
Just so we are clear, that word was "made" by SRS itself.
n/a satanismyhomeboy 2017-07-01
How new are you?
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
That's what a series of subs including SRS call themselves, it's a network that shares the same mods.
n/a jaredschaffer27 2017-07-01
I got banned there just for posting in /r/KotakuInAction
n/a mikerhoa 2017-07-01
I got banned there for daring to suggest that stabbing people passing by on the sidewalk is probably a bit of an overreaction to them catcalling and "invading one's personal space." The entire sub was applauding this girl's call to violence after she spazzed the fuck out over some dudebros commenting at her while she stood outside of the restaurant she worked at.
n/a THEORIGINALSNOOPDONG 2017-07-01
How do you know that's what got you banned? I noticed I'm banned from posting/commenting but can't figure out why.
n/a jaredschaffer27 2017-07-01
I can't be 100% sure, but I post in a relatively small number of subs and multiple other people who have posted in KiA have said they have found themselves banned from there as well. There is a warning on KiA that mentions certain subs will auto-ban you for posting in KiA. Sure enough, I visited those subs and confirmed.
n/a MeatyStew 2017-07-01
Yeah 2XChromazones and OffMyChest do as well as many more
It's against reddit ToS to auto ban or something but they don't care
n/a SaintJason 2017-07-01
Well they didn't do wrong for that KiA is a shit hole
n/a jaredschaffer27 2017-07-01
Says the guy posting in /r/drama
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
If you want hysterical Trumptard drama just ping /u/KigurumiMajin and youll be all set. He's without a doubt the king of the short bus pant shitters. Go ahead, give it a try, I'll wait.
n/a KigurumiMajin 2017-07-01
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
n/a KigurumiMajin 2017-07-01
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
n/a KigurumiMajin 2017-07-01
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
So kys
n/a KigurumiMajin 2017-07-01
Pink skin.
n/a JohnBlind 2017-07-01
Respeck
n/a KigurumiMajin 2017-07-01
Real recognize real niggihh.
n/a JohnBlind 2017-07-01
And he don't look familiar
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
I didn't, that's the best part. Also, pretty hypocritical of you to whine about downvoting when all you do is downvote every comment that doesn't agree with yours.
n/a FrostBittenSalsa 2017-07-01
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
only 5 and a half more years!
n/a PoorLilMarco 2017-07-01
/u/halfar I've got to commend you on your autistic hysteric screeching, you should come over and become a regular here, you'll fit right in!
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
Should be a mod.
n/a THEORIGINALSNOOPDONG 2017-07-01
That person is literally batshit insane. I can't believe they have upvotes. Want to convince someone to your side? Don't scream and swear at them.
n/a DoktuhParadox 2017-07-01
/u/OriginalPorpoise what's it like being so brave as to criticize Trump on leddit?
n/a PoorLilMarco 2017-07-01
Don't mock him, he literally risked his life posting those things on the internet now that Adolf Drumpf has established the fourth reich and banned all criticism of him, his policies, and most importantly his hair.
n/a DoktuhParadox 2017-07-01
All hail the blessed comb-over-under.
n/a xrayjones2000 2017-07-01
My comment is not a soap box, i got soap boxes, i got soap boxes that are like 2 or 3 feet tall. We are not arguing about the same position here. /s you commented, i commented and up vote down vote its really all meaningless because we are making the same point.
n/a MillionDollarCheese 2017-07-01
In an interview, Trump promised that health care under him would be:
cheaper,
better, and
available to everyone (everyone will be covered and the government will pay for it)
Without resorting to semantics or hypotheticals, I doubt anyone can say the new bill achieves this or ever will.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
If you wait for enough people to die from lack of healthcare, it becomes cheaper to offer all the survivors great healthcare. Plus you'll have eliminated most of the chronic illnesses, and kept only mostly healthy people. 4D chess.
n/a MarchForCucks 2017-07-01
Oiy vey goyim! You need to pay 75% of your income to provide medical care to the fat fuck Boogie who is too lazy top get up off his fat fucking ass to diet or exercise.
n/a MarchForCucks 2017-07-01
I pray to Satan daily that the fat fucking slobbish pile of human shit known as "Boogie" dies a horrible painful death. Please god Emperor take away this lardass obese disgusting waste of humanity and throw its garbage husk of a human corpse into a hole in the ground. Amen.
n/a MarchForCucks 2017-07-01
Its an entire thread of imbeciles that cannot comprehend that healthcare is a private capitalist gambling business that generates revenue for it's share holders by making smart bets.
The insurance company is betting that you will not get sick or hurt, and you are betting that you will get sick or hurt.
Insurance companies make no profit if you come to the gambling table and want the house to immediately pay out $200,000.00 to cover a preexisting condition.
These asshats want government tax payer provided socialized medicine but they are too big of gigantic moronic faggots to even understand basic economics.
"The first lesson of economics is scarcity: there is never enough of anything to fully satisfy all those who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics." -Thomas Sowell
n/a mikerhoa 2017-07-01
So the solution is to strip people of benefits and have them become more of a burden on the public system anyway? How does that make sense again?
n/a MarchForCucks 2017-07-01
"benefits"
n/a mikerhoa 2017-07-01
That... doesn't answer either of my questions.
n/a grungebot5000 2017-07-01
considering that Trump supporters weren't living in objective reality to begin with, I don't get why people keep thinking they'd be swayed by the mere facts of his presidency. much less the obvious (D) alarmism they always jump to.
n/a mikerhoa 2017-07-01
Ah yes, /r/offmychest, my first permaban way back in the olden days of 2012.
n/a ReBurnInator 2017-07-01
His did a trump supporter make it in to begin with? They ban people for posting in pretty much any subreddit that's not /r/OffMyChest.
n/a anothergodamnaccount 2017-07-01
Holy fuck the whole thread is just: >reasonable, logical point as to why this man disagrees with the notion that Trump is literally Hitler > "BUT WHAT ABOUT MY FEEEEEELINGS >>>:::(((("
n/a PureGold07 2017-07-01
People who hate Trump are always crying about hysteria. Lmfao they're fucking hilarious
OMFG I CAN'T. I'm literally crying
Also OffMyChest is a shit show. Go to TrueOffMyChest. The better one of those two. They will literally ban you for not having opinions they disagree with.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
No they'll preemptively ban you if they feel you might at some point have an opinion they disagree with.
n/a Cake_eater666 2017-07-01
If no one likes him how did he win? Really makes you think.
n/a Elick320 2017-07-01
/u/halfar
I think it's not entirely clear why you hate trump and conservatives, can you please use bigger words and even more bolding? Thanks.
n/a IAintThatGuy 2017-07-01
He thinks that if his words can't be seen from orbit, his parents will die.
n/a jimmahdean 2017-07-01
So, I'm banned from /r/offmychest, but I do need to butt in here..
This isn't really true. There's also a huge problem of: if we institute national healthcare we will destroy billion dollar insurance companies and kill thousands of jobs overnight. It's a lot more than just republicans saying fuck national health care.
n/a saint2e 2017-07-01
Given /r/offmychest 's aggressive thought-crime policy of pre-banning people for posting in other subs, how did this even happen?