1981 Fredric Wertham on the fascism of Superman :marseyauthright::marseyspaceghost2:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=KWLe5JbJoJc

:marseyfreud:Its is utterly impossible to understand what happened in Germany. All the different massacres and so on unless you realize they were imbued with this Superman spirit. It represents the abolition of law, the Superman is above the law, all laws. Democratic law, the real law, and even the law of physics and chemistry. He's a person to himself. So what you teach the young person, and incidentally the older person too, is that you have no responsibility. You have to appeal to one individual who will take care of everything.

:marseyfreud:Boys, and have seen some myself I have to examine them, have really tried that to jump over the banister, fall down, and break their leg. Or try to almost go out of the window. Or later on as men there many of my patients telling me look as a child you I really thought fly or thank God I didn't try but I know someone who did. He [Superman] represents superstition. So here you have violence, superstition, complete distrust in the community, complete distrust in the law, complete trust in a strong individual who can do things which cannot be done.

:marseyreportercnn: What do you think of the idea that Superman stands for truth, justice, and the American Way.

:marseyfreud: Well how can one stand for something that doesn't exist it's very difficult, but he doesn't for one thing he doesn't he comes at the last moment flies through the air and helps. That's not what the girls know who have been r*ped and killed and mutilated. They don't need someone to fly through the air. You need a policeman on the beat to see that this neighborhood gets nuts in such a weird way. So to say Superman stands for right and stands for the good that may have been so in the beginning when these two school boys started him it may have been so but at the present moment Superman stands for violence.

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It sounds like he interprets any work of fiction featuring characters with superhuman ability as inherently fascistic, especially if these "supermen" are portrayed in a positive light.

I dunno, I guess something like Kingdom Come has fascist overtones, but it feels silly to apply that to 1950s capeshit: it's like saying that a schoolyard game in which children pretend to have superpowers is teaching them they're above the law.

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I dont think very many mainstream comics are written with explicitly right wing views in minds (beyond like Frank Miller or Chuck Dixon) but I think there is a high degree of hero worship that makes it, even if subtly so, right wing. This is strange when you realize most of these writers are pretty left wing, even historically. That's sort of the push and pull. You have the violent authoritarian god king who has an absolute morality stronger and higher then any mere mortal, but he capitulates to the establishment and the liberal order and liberal morality. Yet, it seems like everyone is always a hair string away from getting mad at the heroes and mocking them and forcing them away. Its like even the people in the comics know something is off. I could sperg about this all day :marseyautism: :marseyshy3: but really I feel like there is something there. Something deep and old hidden among the cultural garbage that the progressives forgot to snuff out in the great improvement of society.

Really the main thing I wanted to show with this was that contrary to population belief the anti comics crusade wasn't just a a far right christofacist hysteria plot to destroy left wing EC comics like many redditors like to claim but rather a progressive manifestation of the brown scare and the ideas wrapped in with fascism at the time(crime, violence, homosexuality, pedophilia, and paganism).

https://i.rdrama.net/images/16873054758541493.webp

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I could sperg about this all day :marseyautism: :marseyshy3:

Luckily, I am equally neurodivergent (but less knowledgeable about comics).

I dont think very many mainstream comics are written with explicitly right wing views in minds (beyond like Frank Miller or Chuck Dixon) but I think there is a high degree of hero worship that makes it, even if subtly so, right wing.

I notice the right-wing authoritarian overtones tend to get more overt once you start, for lack of a better word, subverting the narrative.

Giving the X-Men an island-nation suddenly flips their narrative from "civil rights" to "eugenics cult", making Superman alien in anything other than backstory gets you Miraclemanor Invincible, I guess.

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Watchmen is pretty much the ur-anti superhero book, yeah its famous and arguably overrated, but I think its one of the few superhero deconstructions which just leaves the genre in rubble. I think Moore was getting at what I was saying. You have Adrian/Ozymandias and he's openly called a leftist and a progressive in story, but he engages in massive hero worship of Alexander the great and the hero mentally leaves him being a genocidal maniac who enacts an r-slured plan lifted from a pulpy sci fi show (literally ozy watches the episode "The Architects of Fear" from The Outer Limits). Unlike Miracleman where the super being takes a vested interest in human society in Watchmen Dr Manhatten is so powerful he is beyond humanity he has no use for humanity he just leaves and goes off to play god elsewhere.

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Yeah, didn't want to mention Watchmen to not seem like a pleb, but I understand what you're saying.

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This is a really long way of saying you don't frick.

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