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Supreme Court gun case just dropped!

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/21pdf/20-843_7j80.pdf

Sneed

Tl;dr this doesn't affect shall issue states. They just ruled that "may issue" was unconstitutional. States can still require licensing

@JoeBiden @Swagman @idio3

The State of New York makes it a crime to possess a firearm without a license, whether inside or outside the home. An individual who wants to carry a firearm outside his home may obtain an unrestricted license to “have and carry” a concealed “pistol or revolver” if he can prove that “proper cause exists” for doing so. N. Y. Penal Law Ann. §400.00(2)(f ). An applicant satisfies the “proper cause” requirement only if he can “demonstrate a special need for self-protection distinguishable from that of the general community.” E.g., In re Klenosky, 75 App. Div. 2d 793, 428 N. Y. S. 2d 256, 257.

Petitioners Brandon Koch and Robert Nash are adult, law-abiding New York residents who both applied for unrestricted licenses to carry a handgun in public based on their generalized interest in self-defense. The State denied both of their applications for unrestricted licenses, allegedly because Koch and Nash failed to satisfy the “proper cause” requirement. Petitioners then sued respondents—state officials who oversee the processing of licensing applications—for declaratory and injunctive relief, alleging that respondents violated their Second and Fourteenth Amendment rights by denying their unrestricted-license applications for failure to demonstrate a unique need for self-defense. The District Court dismissed petitioners’ complaint and the Court of Appeals affirmed. Both courts relied on the Second Circuit’s prior de- cision in Kachalsky v. County of Westchester, 701 F. 3d 81, which had sustained New York’s proper-cause standard, holding that the require- ment was “substantially related to the achievement of an important governmental interest.” Id., at 96.

2 NEW YORK STATE RIFLE & PISTOL ASSN., INC. v. BRUEN Syllabus

Held: New York’s proper-cause requirement violates the Fourteenth Amendment by preventing law-abiding citizens with ordinary self-de- fense needs from exercising their Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms in public for self-defense. Pp. 8–63.

(1) It is undisputed that petitioners Koch and Nash—two ordi- nary, law-abiding, adult citizens—are part of “the people” whom the Second Amendment protects. See Heller, 554 U. S., at 580. And no party disputes that handguns are weapons “in common use” today for self-defense. See id., at 627. The Court has little difficulty concluding also that the plain text of the Second Amendment protects Koch’s and Nash’s proposed course of conduct—carrying handguns publicly for self-defense. Nothing in the Second Amendment’s text draws a home/public distinction with respect to the right to keep and bear arms, and the definition of “bear” naturally encompasses public carry. Moreover, the Second Amendment guarantees an “individual right to possess and carry weapons in case of confrontation,” id., at 592, and confrontation can surely take place outside the home. Pp. 23–24.

If the last decade of Second Amendment litigation has taught this Court anything, it is that federal courts tasked with making such difficult empirical judgments regarding firearm regulations under the banner of “intermediate scru- tiny” often defer to the determinations of legislatures. But while that judicial deference to legislative interest balanc- ing is understandable—and, elsewhere, appropriate—it is not deference that the Constitution demands here. The Sec- ond Amendment “is the very product of an interest balanc- ing by the people” and it “surely elevates above all other interests the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms” for self-defense. Heller, 554 U. S., at 635. It is this balance—struck by the traditions of the American peo- ple—that demands our unqualified deference.

Heller further confirmed that the right to “bear arms” refers to the right to “wear, bear, or carry . . . upon the person or in the clothing or in a pocket, for the purpose . . . of being armed and ready for offensive or defensive action in a case of conflict with another person.” Id., at 584 (quoting Mus- carello v. United States, 524 U. S. 125, 143 (1998) (Gins- burg, J., dissenting); internal quotation marks omitted).

This definition of “bear” naturally encompasses public carry. Most gun owners do not wear a holstered pistol at their hip in their bedroom or while sitting at the dinner ta- ble. Although individuals often “keep” firearms in their home, at the ready for self-defense, most do not “bear” (i.e., carry) them in the home beyond moments of actual confron- tation. To confine the right to “bear” arms to the home would nullify half of the Second Amendment’s operative protections.

Throughout modern Anglo-American history, the right to keep and bear arms in public has tra- ditionally been subject to well-defined restrictions govern- ing the intent for which one could carry arms, the manner of carry, or the exceptional circumstances under which one could not carry arms. But apart from a handful of late- 19th-century jurisdictions, the historical record compiled by respondents does not demonstrate a tradition of broadly prohibiting the public carry of commonly used firearms for self-defense. Nor is there any such historical tradition lim- iting public carry only to those law-abiding citizens who demonstrate a special need for self-defense.9 We conclude that respondents have failed to meet their burden to iden- tify an American tradition justifying New York’s proper- cause requirement. Under Heller’s text-and-history stand- ard, the proper-cause requirement is therefore unconstitu- tional.

To summarize: The historical evidence from antebellum America does demonstrate that the manner of public carry was subject to reasonable regulation. Under the common law, individuals could not carry deadly weapons in a man- ner likely to terrorize others. Similarly, although surety statutes did not directly restrict public carry, they did pro- vide financial incentives for responsible arms carrying. Fi- nally, States could lawfully eliminate one kind of public carry—concealed carry—so long as they left open the option to carry openly.

After the Civil War, of course, the exercise of this funda- mental right by freed slaves was systematically thwarted. This Court has already recounted some of the Southern abuses violating blacks’ right to keep and bear arms.

At the end of this long journey through the Anglo-American history of public carry, we conclude that respondents have not met their burden to identify an American tradition jus- tifying the State’s proper-cause requirement. The Second Amendment guaranteed to “all Americans” the right to bear commonly used arms in public subject to certain reasona- ble, well-defined restrictions. Heller, 554 U. S., at 581. Those restrictions, for example, limited the intent for which one could carry arms, the manner by which one carried arms, or the exceptional circumstances under which one could not carry arms, such as before justices of the peace and other government officials. Apart from a few late-19th- century outlier jurisdictions, American governments simply have not broadly prohibited the public carry of commonly used firearms for personal defense. Nor, subject to a few late-in-time outliers, have American governments required law-abiding, responsible citizens to “demonstrate a special need for self-protection distinguishable from that of the general community” in order to carry arms in public. Klenosky, 75 App. Div., at 793, 428 N. Y. S. 2d, at 257.

The constitutional right to bear arms in public for self- defense is not “a second-class right, subject to an entirely different body of rules than the other Bill of Rights guaran- tees.” McDonald, 561 U. S., at 780 (plurality opinion). We know of no other constitutional right that an individual may exercise only after demonstrating to government offic-ers some special need. That is not how the First Amend- ment works when it comes to unpopular speech or the free exercise of religion. It is not how the Sixth Amendment works when it comes to a defendant’s right to confront the witnesses against him. And it is not how the Second Amendment works when it comes to public carry for self- defense.

New York’s proper-cause requirement violates the Four- teenth Amendment in that it prevents law-abiding citizens with ordinary self-defense needs from exercising their right to keep and bear arms. We therefore reverse the judgment of the Court of Appeals and remand the case for further pro- ceedings consistent with this opinion.

Kavanaugh concurring:

First, the Court’s decision does not prohibit States from imposing licensing requirements for carrying a handgun for self-defense. In particular, the Court’s decision does not af- fect the existing licensing regimes—known as “shall-issue” regimes—that are employed in 43 States


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You wouldn't have the votes with or without the filibuster, why lie like that's the problem?


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Reading comprehension.

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I didn't let you change the subject to a different one, I read and understood your ratfrick intentions and ignored them. There is no substance to your position, you want to subvert the rights of the people and are enraged that they get a say.


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It's not changing the subject to say that if mundane legislation can't be passed due to a particular threshold, other legislation with an even higher threshold is more or less impossible.

Reading comprehension.

"You're mean and have no argument"

You should go to Reddit.

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The document is living, there is a process for changing it. It requires you to actually have the people's will to do it. It's not obstructionist stopping you, it's the exact idesign that you can't do this without an overwhelming popular mandate. It's explicitly not mundane legislation just because you call it that.


:#marseytwerking:

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Pretty good understanding of civics 101. Returning to the current situation, this isn't an issue of repealing or creating an amendment. It's about the Supreme Court overturning settled law and taking away states' rights.

It could be fixed with an amendment, but that doesn't make the scotus decision any less wrong. Plessy could have been fixed with an amendment.

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Maybe you need to go back to civics 101. Law that directly violates the constitution is not "settled". The 10th amenent gives the states the power not granted to the federal gov in the constitution. Guess what is included in that rather short list of things? You need an amendment because that's how you negate things in the constitution and what you want to do is negate something in the constitution. It's really that simple.

Seriously, it's hard to express show stupid your "settled law" bit is. Do I need to come up with some examples of settled laws or are you capable of remembering American history?


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It was settled law for a century because it had not been successfully challenged.

hard to express show stupid your "settled law" bit is.

Stare decisis.

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The Supreme Court is allowed to overturn precedent. When judicial precedent contradicts the constitution the constitution wins, otherwise the legislature would have no power whatsoever.

But this is all just obscurantism trying to win a simple argument by pretending it's actually complicated. The constitution forbids may issue laws. That the court was derelict in its duty to tell these states more forcefully to frick off is immaterial.

If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like heck

You're at the petulant table pounding stage.


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