Here we spot wild Bardfinn Bluesky activities.
Be valid and ping ! bardfinn for something worthwhile or create a new thread.
/h/bardfanns
BardWatch
She/Her
Anti-Hate-Brigade
20d ago
(text post)
22 thread views
#334010
earned 16 coins from votes
Bard spotting on Bluesky 17 January 2025 
- 15
- 5
Now playing: In A Snow-Bound Land (DKC2).mp3
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
I want to do a quick "How To Tell That This Is An Op" tutorial, because apparently some propaganda tank or trollboard somewhere decided it's time to send out Leftist Trolls, and they're both very bad at it but also very effective.
So let's talk about How To Troll, Generic
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
I want to point out how these trolls are being constructed by borrowing from Innuendo Studios' "The Card Says «Moops»" video — which deconstructed this for the alt-Right, in the context of their "I'm just joking ahah or am I" deflection tactic (but which tactic is 100% optional)
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Actual, authentic advocacy and engagement and argument follows the Truth -> Belief -> Argument model.
That's the rational and appropriate approach — it means that you can be persuaded, that you're approaching in good faith.
Trolls use Argument -> Belief -> Truth. That's Bad Faith.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
That, above, is the core of how to spot Bad Faith approaches - the essence of trolling.
Proselytisation uses this approach - with an argument that i.e. "Veganism is a moral / ethical good".
Who can argue against veganism, right? No one (save bad guys) enjoys killing, right?
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
So the position of Veganism makes for a relatively unassailable Discourse Position, allowing its professors to socially justify approaching and sustaining Discourse with people online who would normally never consent to being buttonholed and berated
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
This is perfect fertile ground for Trolling.
It also has a benefit — it exploits the fact that professional and volunteer moderators don't recognise it as trolling, because 99% of mods are looking for "LOL MAGA TRUMP ONLY 2 GENDERS HEY CHICKS" vulgarity
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
And the targets don't recognise it as trolling - its professors avoid common vulgar signposts of trolling, like namecalling, strawmen, common fallacies, etc — and a lot of people want to be better! The nominal appeal here is that there's a way to be better!
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
But the trolls deploying this approach (in this current phenomenon to brandish Veganism as their moral shield) are committing the Argument -> Belief -> Truth approach, and exploiting another aspect of the essence of trolling: Sincerity is Unprovable and Open to Interpretation
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Are these trolls really sincere in their nominal promotion of Veganism? If you accept that they are, you're obligated to entertain them! If you question their sincerity, then they can play Victim, and cast you as the Persecutor (doubly, because You Eat Meat, Which is Murder!)
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
(As Innuendo Studios points out in "The Card Says «Moops»",
'stay focused on the argument, and you won't even notice this is happening!')
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
But they have tells showing they're insincere.
First: They're Proselytising.
They defend this behaviour with "moral movements are militant", but the truth is that persuading people to do something moral via proselytisation doesn't work.
Recruiting people to a cult via proselytisation, though —
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Second: they're term-searching.
They don't know you or any of your friends; they show up to proselytise because someone in the thread used a term, and they searched it, and decided to parachute in.
We're used to Twitter & other forums where arguments spontaneously blossom between strangers, right?
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Third: They use negging.
This is from the Karpman Drama Triangle dynamic — they behave in a way to subtly or overtly cast you as The Bad Guy and themselves as The Rescuer, to force an interpersonal dynamic that puts them in control.
It's the core of what MRAs do with women, and evangelicals with …
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Well, evangelicals do it with everyone else, especially potential converts.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Fourth: They don't respect boundaries.
There's kind of a fuzzy boundary against parachuting into someone's mentions and engaging them in an argument, right? People look past that a lot more because of other social media normalising it.
But these folks won't take "goodbye" for an answer.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
You tell them, in subtle ways ("Ok, have a nice day/night") and not subtle ways ("I don't want to go into this with you"), and they keep the pressure up.
That's your interpersonal boundaries you've expressed, and they're walking through them!
They don't respect you as a person.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
Just like the MAGA transphobes flooding in here to vomit "haha, I invaded your safe space, bluesky", they aren't here to persuade you to be vegan — they're here to exercise social power, and to monopolise attention and cultural market share, by exploiting the same dynamics used by Twitter trolls
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
So,
Now you know how to recognise these trolls, no matter the pretexts they claim to represent!
And use the nuclear block!
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
(FTR, a good argument for veganism is that Miso is Delicious, that Tofu is Delicious, and that the cultural Chinese model of "veganism" is a dish of soy & vegetables, sometimes flavoured with a little pork, or beef laoganma - Reduce! You can get there!)
Cassandra of Troy (@cassandraoftroy.bsky.social):
(Also Indian veggie dishes!)
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
You can type 10,000 characters and you decided that these were the one's that you wanted.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
More options
Context
(@borednoodle.bsky.social):
Really appreciate you breaking this down but this makes me thinking about why any social media based antifascists are doomed to fail in winning people over to their side. They refuse to engage in legitimate discourse because they assume ANY dissent is some sort of bot campaign against them 1/2
(@borednoodle.bsky.social):
Because of the views that they hold, so they alienate people interested in legitimate discourse. To the average bystander trying to follow a thread and actually learn though, it makes their position look indefensible and it makes them look like a total butthole. 2/2
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
The very best way to be antifascist is to live fully and authentically and unapologetically- not giving the fash's Discourse attempts any credence
(@borednoodle.bsky.social):
The reason this trolling technique is so effective is because it's SUCCESSFUL EITHER WAY. In trying go shield itself from these trolls, the movement fractures itself by blocking and alienating people that are on their side who dare question their views, even if it is out of actual curiousity.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
(@borednoodle.bsky.social):
I can generally agree with someone - fascists do, in fact, suck shit - but not think that everything every self avowed antifascist says is unquestionably correct. Everyone on this app just seems so fricking performative and they block anyone that disagrees with them for any reason. It's not helpful.
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
People here block just to manage their time and attention. They block on intuition. "Does this interaction spark joy? No? Block". They'll block people parachuting into the chat their friend group is having.
It incentivises joining a convo to be friendly / accomplish something
Ms. Penny Oaken, SkyWitch (@skywitches.net):
It also undermines a common troll tactic of The Oxygen of Amplification, used to harass and spread disinfo. Like digging firebreaks.
(@borednoodle.bsky.social):
I get why they do it, but that doesn't stop it from undermining the movement that they're trying to give traction to. All I'm saying is that awareness of this tactic isn't going to stop it from being effective and that's shitty for worthwhile movements that are often targeted by trolls.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
More options
Context
More options
Context
More options
Context