Reading actual history, he was one of the absolute worst generals of the entire war, in either western front, eastern front, or pacific theater
The only reason why there is any level of modern reverence to the man, is because he was a massive Madonna, and utilized a massive public relations program for his image back into burgerland
Virtually every fricking time, the Pacific High command ignored his stupidity, they hastened america's island hopping victories
Not to mention he came the closest in US history to defying civilian control of the military, which is the only thing that separates civilized man from the beasts
When? Post WW2 pretty absolute, it was almost a semi-militerized state for 6 decades straight, there was never any chance for a general to defy the prime minister in any meaningful way, the apartheid era government was pretty united on the military and civil level - the fear of communism was so profound, that it united them, including white bongs and boers, in a manner which is hard to describe
I know a lot of people today have no grasp of a Red Scare hysteria or fear of nuclear Armageddon, but back then it proliferated all readings and speeches and thinking of people in the period of 1950-1989. The fear of communism made people into a difficult to describe irrational rationalism, where it was better to remain a united people (for whites) than to divide the country and be picked off piecemeal by the evergrowing influence of the Soviets.
I've seen a couple of dramatards perceive me talking about communism as if it was a pitiable excuse for whites to uphold apartheid, but back then the terror was so fricking profound amongst the afrikaans, that there were daily hysterical breakouts amongst women fainting lol.
A common doomsaying was that Cuban and african communist forces would obliterate all anti-communist forces, and the SADF would have a last stand on the Orange river, the largest river in the country, and biggest natural feature from which to man a plausible defense against tanks, from a North-South divide, in a massive push all the way from Angola and northern Mozambique.
The doomsaying was a constant talk, and took inspiration from the Pusan river battle, the last natural feature from which the Yanks and Republic of Korea forces were able to just barely hold on against North Korean blitzkrieg, in the 1950 Korea-war, south africans took inspiration from these events that a similar horror was in store for us, but without the benefit of Yank superior airpower and aircraft carrier battle groups to swing the tide.
Because of thoughts and thinking patterns like this, for the duration of the High Apartheid era, to answer your question, the Union of SA leadership was always pretty ironclad, with inter-department fights, but nothing approaching insurrection, even if some populist general had the ability
So the military obeyed faithfully and it was just a consensus, were coloured and blacks mistreated in the army back then?
I've seen a couple of dramatards perceive me talking about communism as if it was a pitiable excuse for whites to uphold apartheid, but back then the terror was so fricking profound amongst the afrikaans
Same with the threat of communism looming over Latam. Except than unlike South Africa, the Brazilian military was a political actor on its own right (a state within a state the Civil government had no full control of until after 1985).
Like most afrikaans agree that the reason, 70% of whites voted to end Apartheid in the 1990 referendum held by De Klerk, the last white president, was because the Soviet Union had collapsed, and it was like the fear of an international red-scare had evaporated overnight,
and with that absence of an internal fear, the control which the NP regime had excersized over its white population via propaganda, had also gone limp - other say that De klerk and the white population saw the writings on the wall for international relations, but that these two factors worked in tandem is often agreed, depending on the historian themselves off
with that absence of an internal fear, the control which the NP regime had excersized over its white population via propaganda, had also gone limp - other say that De klerk and the white population saw the writings on the wall for international relations, but that these two factors worked in tandem is often agreed, depending on the historian themselves off
I imagine that without the threat of communist expansion the US have no excuses to avoid placing hard sanctions on South Africa. But wasn't the regime already overstretched by 1990? I mean, 5 million whites ruled over 35 million people who were treated either as second class citizens or foreigners with no rights, plus black Fertility Rate was higher, wasn't the Government concerned about low white birth rates?
BushWasRightfree/dom
There's no ideology but liberal democracy and Fukuyama is its prophet
johannesalthusius 7mo ago#6250337
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James Gavin fricked over market garden (although his bong superiors should have checked his paranoia and told him the reason his fricking division is being paradropped is to take the fricking bridge not some hills to the east)
Joseph Stilwell was given command of few good troops china had left, and proceed to yeet them away by ignoring advice from their Chinx commanders. He then fled the battle while most of his army was disorganized but still fighting. Having fricked up Chinese war effort bigly, he proceed to blame it all on Chinx incompetence/corruption, contributing to Truman abandoning them to commies. He then wrote his memoirs saying that Chiang China was so fricked up commie victory was inevietable, which was picked up by academia and got him whitewashed as it was 'Nam already and commie 5th columnists wanted to pretend the same applies to Norks.
And while admirals aren't generals, William Halsey Jr. fricked off from protecting invasion troops in Philippines chasing literal , leading to costliest US naval battle of the war, and it's a miracle it wasn't a defeat followed by slaughter of troop transports.
(at the same time US fleet subordinated to Big Mac actually did their fricking job and sank Jap southern force without losses)
Also Big Mac was bigly influential in rebuilding Japan and making it a functional country, at a time when Washington decision makers focused on euros and didn't give two fricks about Asia.
You really love slurping British peepee, don't you?
If Gavin made mistakes he certainly wasn't the only one, and he was acting on bad intelligence. Which was bad because everything in Market-Garden was done in a rushed, reckless, and half-assed way. And we all know which cricket enthusiast is to blame for that.
Again with Stillwell, the British needed a scapegoat for their disasters in Burma and duplicity in doing everything possible to undermine the Chinese war effort in hopes of hobbling Chang's regime postwar.
He then wrote his memoirs saying that Chiang China was so fricked up commie victory was inevietable
This is what happens when everything you know you get from Eurotrash youtubers like Mark Felton instead of actually reading the fricking book. He died almost immediately after the war and his wife published a collection of his diaries and various notes he'd written during the war. This material was written contemporaneously, not after the war to justify himself. The fact that you believe it was indicates you've been lied to, are r-slurred, or both.
US fleet subordinated to Big Mac actually did their fricking job and sank Jap southern force
Yeah it was all thanks to MacArthur's brilliant naval strategy.
His reputation for being an r-slur is as exaggerated by his critics (especially in the age of youtube and zoomers) as his reputation for being a genius by his supporters of the time.
The best impression I've gotten of him is from Ridgway who worked directly with him, certainly was qualified to judge, and was not a butthurt political wingcuck. He pointed out that nobody else but MacArthur would have recognized the opportunity at Incheon, have the guts to try it, and be able to sell it to the joint chiefs. On the other hand he made some big mistakes afterward like shifting X Corps to the east coast that were typical of him.
If you look at his campaigns in WW2 he knew how to integrate air, land, and sea power in a way that few other leaders had to. Mistakes were made but he wiped out a huge part of the Japanese military and secured the bases in the Philippines that we would have needed to invade Japan at relatively little cost.
He also had a tendency to go to pieces when things went wrong (Philippines 1941, Korea) and just become catatonic for days. That's less a matter of r-sluration and more of some kind of mental illness.
probably besides the point tho bc didnt the soviets have nukes by the korean war, so they would have retaliated against us?
Yes, their first test was in 1949, however in the early 50s the Soviet arsenal was still small compared with the American one and they didn't have means to deploy it over the US. There was no way of knowing that for sure back then though.
The main reason Truman refused was to avoid setting a bad precedent, nukes are for deterrence, not something to be used in every conflict, had they used them in Korea is likely so would the Soviets and eventually it could lead to a full scale nuclear war.
Yeah I was under the impression that we basically knew frick all about Soviet military capabilities around that time, and it wasn't until we started flying U-2's over Soviet territory that we got anything even remotely resembling good intel. It's just much easier to keep things secret in an oppressive, authoritarian regime where they can just shoot you on suspicion of being a spy without any kind of trial.
It's probably ultimately a good thing that we've never really had a nuclear war (I barely count the end of WW2 given its limited scope, and the fact that we arguably killed far more people in firebombing campaigns than with the nukes). I doubt it would have ended up like The Road (was that nukes?) or other similar dystopian worlds since I think governments are much more resilient than those stories give them credit for, but it sure would suck having to live your life close to a nuclear bunker, plus I think you'd see a lot of anti-urban planning because a bunch of far-flung suburbs are much more difficult to target than a tightly-packed city.
Redactor0naori/oppa
Darklands shill, do not engage
tempest 7mo ago#6250568
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it wasn't until we started flying U-2's over Soviet territory that we got anything even remotely resembling good intel
There were bits and pieces that came out through refugees and released German POWs. And there was some photography by balloons and a few flights by modified B-57s. But yeah the interior of the USSR was mostly a mystery until the U-2 and especially the Corona satellites in the early '60s.
I think it was pretty well understood by the CIA that the US had a massive advantage in nuclear weapons at this time but there was real fear that they always seemed a few years from catching up to us.
Avalonthey/them 7mo ago#6250300
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He was a much better politician than he was a general. Especially in regards to Asia. One of the few to see early on that China wasn't yet another Soviet puppet state and shouldn't just be treated as an extension of the USSR like the Warsaw Pact was in Europe for example. But he was meh on almost everything else
Redactor0naori/oppa
Darklands shill, do not engage
7mo ago#6250984
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What's really scandalous about this is apparently MacArthur hadn't been briefed on what nuclear weapons could actually do, how many we had, etc. I guess because keeping them under civilian control was such a big deal at the time. At the time only the US was bluffing about how powerful our nuclear forces were and apparently he bought it.
The idea of the radioactive belt as a barrier is totally ludicrous if you look at the numbers involved but apparently he didn't ever ask a physicist before he ran his mouth.
Snappybeep/boop
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7mo ago#6249852
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This should come as no surprise. These are the same people who literally argue in favor of the mayocide. Did you forget about that? I didn't. /r/Drama posters are literally pro-mayocide. That's not even me being hyperbolic or making insults, it's simply a fact.
They.
Are.
Not.
Human.
They are neurodivergents. And they are completely irredeemable.
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MacArthur fits the definition of based r-slur
!historychads
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He was just a r-slur, America's most overrated general
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Reading actual history, he was one of the absolute worst generals of the entire war, in either western front, eastern front, or pacific theater
The only reason why there is any level of modern reverence to the man, is because he was a massive Madonna, and utilized a massive public relations program for his image back into burgerland
Virtually every fricking time, the Pacific High command ignored his stupidity, they hastened america's island hopping victories
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Not to mention he came the closest in US history to defying civilian control of the military, which is the only thing that separates civilized man from the beasts
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The Brazilian Armed Forces in shambles
@kaamrev how much control did civil government and the NP had over the South African Defense Force?
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When? Post WW2 pretty absolute, it was almost a semi-militerized state for 6 decades straight, there was never any chance for a general to defy the prime minister in any meaningful way, the apartheid era government was pretty united on the military and civil level - the fear of communism was so profound, that it united them, including white bongs and boers, in a manner which is hard to describe
I know a lot of people today have no grasp of a Red Scare hysteria or fear of nuclear Armageddon, but back then it proliferated all readings and speeches and thinking of people in the period of 1950-1989. The fear of communism made people into a difficult to describe irrational rationalism, where it was better to remain a united people (for whites) than to divide the country and be picked off piecemeal by the evergrowing influence of the Soviets.
I've seen a couple of dramatards perceive me talking about communism as if it was a pitiable excuse for whites to uphold apartheid, but back then the terror was so fricking profound amongst the afrikaans, that there were daily hysterical breakouts amongst women fainting lol.
A common doomsaying was that Cuban and african communist forces would obliterate all anti-communist forces, and the SADF would have a last stand on the Orange river, the largest river in the country, and biggest natural feature from which to man a plausible defense against tanks, from a North-South divide, in a massive push all the way from Angola and northern Mozambique.
The doomsaying was a constant talk, and took inspiration from the Pusan river battle, the last natural feature from which the Yanks and Republic of Korea forces were able to just barely hold on against North Korean blitzkrieg, in the 1950 Korea-war, south africans took inspiration from these events that a similar horror was in store for us, but without the benefit of Yank superior airpower and aircraft carrier battle groups to swing the tide.
Because of thoughts and thinking patterns like this, for the duration of the High Apartheid era, to answer your question, the Union of SA leadership was always pretty ironclad, with inter-department fights, but nothing approaching insurrection, even if some populist general had the ability
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Rooi gevaart, Swart gevaart heh
So the military obeyed faithfully and it was just a consensus, were coloured and blacks mistreated in the army back then?
Same with the threat of communism looming over Latam. Except than unlike South Africa, the Brazilian military was a political actor on its own right (a state within a state the Civil government had no full control of until after 1985).
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Like most afrikaans agree that the reason, 70% of whites voted to end Apartheid in the 1990 referendum held by De Klerk, the last white president, was because the Soviet Union had collapsed, and it was like the fear of an international red-scare had evaporated overnight,
and with that absence of an internal fear, the control which the NP regime had excersized over its white population via propaganda, had also gone limp - other say that De klerk and the white population saw the writings on the wall for international relations, but that these two factors worked in tandem is often agreed, depending on the historian themselves off
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I imagine that without the threat of communist expansion the US have no excuses to avoid placing hard sanctions on South Africa. But wasn't the regime already overstretched by 1990? I mean, 5 million whites ruled over 35 million people who were treated either as second class citizens or foreigners with no rights, plus black Fertility Rate was higher, wasn't the Government concerned about low white birth rates?
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OUT!
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James Gavin fricked over market garden (although his bong superiors should have checked his paranoia and told him the reason his fricking division is being paradropped is to take the fricking bridge not some hills to the east)
Joseph Stilwell was given command of few good troops china had left, and proceed to yeet them away by ignoring advice from their Chinx commanders. He then fled the battle while most of his army was disorganized but still fighting. Having fricked up Chinese war effort bigly, he proceed to blame it all on Chinx incompetence/corruption, contributing to Truman abandoning them to commies. He then wrote his memoirs saying that Chiang China was so fricked up commie victory was inevietable, which was picked up by academia and got him whitewashed as it was 'Nam already and commie 5th columnists wanted to pretend the same applies to Norks.
And while admirals aren't generals, William Halsey Jr. fricked off from protecting invasion troops in Philippines chasing literal , leading to costliest US naval battle of the war, and it's a miracle it wasn't a defeat followed by slaughter of troop transports.
(at the same time US fleet subordinated to Big Mac actually did their fricking job and sank Jap southern force without losses)
Also Big Mac was bigly influential in rebuilding Japan and making it a functional country, at a time when Washington decision makers focused on euros and didn't give two fricks about Asia.
!historychads
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You really love slurping British peepee, don't you?
If Gavin made mistakes he certainly wasn't the only one, and he was acting on bad intelligence. Which was bad because everything in Market-Garden was done in a rushed, reckless, and half-assed way. And we all know which cricket enthusiast is to blame for that.
Again with Stillwell, the British needed a scapegoat for their disasters in Burma and duplicity in doing everything possible to undermine the Chinese war effort in hopes of hobbling Chang's regime postwar.
This is what happens when everything you know you get from Eurotrash youtubers like Mark Felton instead of actually reading the fricking book. He died almost immediately after the war and his wife published a collection of his diaries and various notes he'd written during the war. This material was written contemporaneously, not after the war to justify himself. The fact that you believe it was indicates you've been lied to, are r-slurred, or both.
Yeah it was all thanks to MacArthur's brilliant naval strategy.
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I need :marseyredactor0hesright:
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PlsRope
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His reputation for being an r-slur is as exaggerated by his critics (especially in the age of youtube and zoomers) as his reputation for being a genius by his supporters of the time.
The best impression I've gotten of him is from Ridgway who worked directly with him, certainly was qualified to judge, and was not a butthurt political wingcuck. He pointed out that nobody else but MacArthur would have recognized the opportunity at Incheon, have the guts to try it, and be able to sell it to the joint chiefs. On the other hand he made some big mistakes afterward like shifting X Corps to the east coast that were typical of him.
If you look at his campaigns in WW2 he knew how to integrate air, land, and sea power in a way that few other leaders had to. Mistakes were made but he wiped out a huge part of the Japanese military and secured the bases in the Philippines that we would have needed to invade Japan at relatively little cost.
He also had a tendency to go to pieces when things went wrong (Philippines 1941, Korea) and just become catatonic for days. That's less a matter of r-sluration and more of some kind of mental illness.
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I like Ike
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The real dramatard general is Edwin Walker:
Enforced the order to integrate Little Rock High School but it apparently broke his brain because he just liked segregation that much
Was convinced by the John Birch Society that Eisenhower (his commander in chief) was being misled by communists, who had taken over the US government
Was told to resign repeatedly because he kept calling political leaders commies
Punched a journ*list in the face
Was put in an asylum by Robert F Kennedy, the ACLU came to his defense to bail him out for political abuse of psychiatry
Was almost assassinated by Lee Harvey Oswald
Was arrested repeatedly in his old age because he was soliciting dudes in the bathroom
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This almost makes up for the rest of it.
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!coomers here is an easy tutorial on how to win the Korean War:
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Is is WMAF porn to be specific, libtard.
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WMAF?
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White Moid Asian Foid
!soyteens
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Você tá assistindo Shogun? Essa minissérie segue a temática do seu nome de usuário
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NĂŁo, mas agora vou ver
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Korean girls don't know where babies come from lol
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Yo what is that massive underwater object near saafrika?
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i dont know what im looking at
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Wave/wind speed. But nvm.
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When China intervened they were fighting not far from their country and a shit ton of them starved.
Even back then only burgers had logistics
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really makes u think if north korea would be better or worse off today if we did this
probably besides the point tho bc didnt the soviets have nukes by the korean war, so they would have retaliated against us?
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Yes, their first test was in 1949, however in the early 50s the Soviet arsenal was still small compared with the American one and they didn't have means to deploy it over the US. There was no way of knowing that for sure back then though.
The main reason Truman refused was to avoid setting a bad precedent, nukes are for deterrence, not something to be used in every conflict, had they used them in Korea is likely so would the Soviets and eventually it could lead to a full scale nuclear war.
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Yeah I was under the impression that we basically knew frick all about Soviet military capabilities around that time, and it wasn't until we started flying U-2's over Soviet territory that we got anything even remotely resembling good intel. It's just much easier to keep things secret in an oppressive, authoritarian regime where they can just shoot you on suspicion of being a spy without any kind of trial.
It's probably ultimately a good thing that we've never really had a nuclear war (I barely count the end of WW2 given its limited scope, and the fact that we arguably killed far more people in firebombing campaigns than with the nukes). I doubt it would have ended up like The Road (was that nukes?) or other similar dystopian worlds since I think governments are much more resilient than those stories give them credit for, but it sure would suck having to live your life close to a nuclear bunker, plus I think you'd see a lot of anti-urban planning because a bunch of far-flung suburbs are much more difficult to target than a tightly-packed city.
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There were bits and pieces that came out through refugees and released German POWs. And there was some photography by balloons and a few flights by modified B-57s. But yeah the interior of the USSR was mostly a mystery until the U-2 and especially the Corona satellites in the early '60s.
I think it was pretty well understood by the CIA that the US had a massive advantage in nuclear weapons at this time but there was real fear that they always seemed a few years from catching up to us.
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He was a much better politician than he was a general. Especially in regards to Asia. One of the few to see early on that China wasn't yet another Soviet puppet state and shouldn't just be treated as an extension of the USSR like the Warsaw Pact was in Europe for example. But he was meh on almost everything else
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What's really scandalous about this is apparently MacArthur hadn't been briefed on what nuclear weapons could actually do, how many we had, etc. I guess because keeping them under civilian control was such a big deal at the time. At the time only the US was bluffing about how powerful our nuclear forces were and apparently he bought it.
The idea of the radioactive belt as a barrier is totally ludicrous if you look at the numbers involved but apparently he didn't ever ask a physicist before he ran his mouth.
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This should come as no surprise. These are the same people who literally argue in favor of the mayocide. Did you forget about that? I didn't. /r/Drama posters are literally pro-mayocide. That's not even me being hyperbolic or making insults, it's simply a fact.
They.
Are.
Not.
Human.
They are neurodivergents. And they are completely irredeemable.
Snapshots:
:ghostarchive.org
archive.org
archive.ph (click to archive)
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