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E70 they/them  6d ago (image post) 440 thread views #278515
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Ancient Romans were actually ethnic Scandinavians according to 4chan.

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Ironic considering the Goths and other germanic tribes were predatory migrants (actual term used by a serious historian on the fall of the Western Empire)

!historychads, the Western Empire didn't “fell from inside” it was murdered.

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I distinctly remember reading some chud blog (unfortunately I forgot where) that said the Germanic tribes came in to save Rome from racial decline, and I genuinely laughed out loud reading it.

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>predatory migrants

!metashit !dramatards new anti-mayo slur just dropped

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Against attempts to dismiss his account of large migratory invasion of Goths in 376 as a topos, Heather points out that Ammianus was quite capable of distinguishing between different sizes and types of barbarian forces, and that there in nothing implausible about a form of “predatory migration” involving a “massed, mixed group,” even if that group does not really qualify as a “people” but rather as a “coherent mass of population.” Subsequent movements of Vandals, Alans, et cetera, can be similarly understood. Against efforts to find causes within Roman political and military policy, Heather restores the Huns to their primary role in the collapse of the Roman frontier.

He Against attempts to dismiss his account of large migratory invasion of Goths in 376 as a topos, Heather points out that Ammianus was quite capable of distinguishing between different sizes and types of barbarian forces, and that there in nothing implausible about a form of “predatory migration” involving a “massed, mixed group,” even if that group does not really qualify as a “people” but rather as a “coherent mass of population.” Subsequent movements of Vandals, Alans, et cetera, can be similarly understood. Against efforts to find causes within Roman political and military policy, Heather restores the Huns to their primary role in the collapse of the Roman frontier.

Heather even did a seminary “Predatory Migration in the first millennium”

His book about the fall of Rome is worth reading and among the latest scholarship on that period.

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Hmm

I think population pressure from the outside (more and more germanoids) combined with a century of plague made the western empire difficult to hold. Civilian institutions really decayed, leaving

random warlords running the show in western Rome, and then Germanic kingdoms

Though reading books on the early eastern roman empire, I wonder if there was a way to restore the institutions. Late antiquity saw centralized governments across Europe and North Africa collapse,

except in Constantinople where a concerted effort was made to pool half a millenia's worth of gold and capital was gathered to finance a new bureaucratic elite. The caliphates that followed were also ran

successfully for a while as civilian ran countries

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It fell because it got separated from all its resources.

Egypt, Balkans, near east were all really important for Rome for their grain, metal, and manpower.

On the other hand France wasn't really that useful until the Huns brought the heavy plow to Europe from China so it was basically just Italy+North Africa.

Now TBF Italy stayed extremely wealthy even when rome fell, but you can't really run an empire with just the peninsula once france and Germany came online as independent powers with new agricultural innovations and Italy stayed disunited.

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