Greetings dramacels and !bookworms 
As promised, today we are holding our first bookclub discussion thread. We’ll be discussing the first 7 chapters of “The Master and Margarita”, written by the late Russian author Mikhail Bulgakov, set in Stalinist Moscow 
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I hope you have enjoyed these first chapters, I certainly did. Based on the numbers of pages read from chapters 1-7, next week discussion will be about chapters 8-17.
I know it was supposed to be at noon E.T. However I’m posting a bit early because I’m off for a family lunch in half an hour, and I don’t want to longpost there.
Have fun with the discussion!
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Ivan Nikolayevich is a chad. Especially when he squares up to the Professor in chapter 4.
"PAPERS CITIZEN
" 
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Comrade Bezdomny is not feeling well, take him to the asylum
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You're a fellow citizen comrade we must seize this foreigner now!
You're clearly drunk friend
Short of breath? 
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Man has an encounter with something he can't rationally understand, ends up wandering Moscow in his underwear.
Good book so far. I can tell the author really does not like censors
I guess Bulgakov hopes to be a kind of Professor W for his readers, shaking up our worldview with wit and trickery.
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I'm still trying to understand what was the reason for Ivan to jump in the river. Hope it's not just a plot device to make him lose the fancy club card (and setup future hijinks).
The cat trying to pay the bus fare made me
for a moment. That's the kinda of shit I would expect from a Terry Pratchett book, and not from some Soviet writer.
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Well he did have a manic episode clearly,
(with the same unthinking conviction he then headed to Griboedov's).
As for the actual meaning, people read into it a metaphor for baptism, but idk, idk, I think it was just to get him stripped down to underpants and eventually into a psych ward. Notice btw, from chapter 1:
This thing has more lampshades than a Holocaust museum!
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I can see professor
@everyone is our official the book club teacher educating the
peasantsclassJump in the discussion.
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He got fricked with constantly by the politburo censors for his writing. The book was never officially published in lifetime.
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Even when the book was officially published (over twenty years after Bulgakov's death), the USSR heavily censored it and the original manuscript had to be smuggled to the West.
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I quite enjoyed the opening, and the way they were trying to figure out his nationality, Woland is a well-represented and mysterious devil, he seems to have come, not just to torment, but rather in a Faustian way claim his due for the actions of the Massolit degenerates. Men that rely and spout on about the workers revolution but live in luxury. This, of course is emphasized later when Riukhin literally says he belives nothing of what he writes, and that's he living a lie.
I like you guys' takes on the Pilates chapter... it perplexed to say the least. I don't feel i can cross-reference well-enough but this thread has certainly given new perspective.
The wild goose-chase across Moscow was funny, and a good introduction to what could be called the 'Antagonists'. I quite enjoyed the seeming meaning behind the locations that were astrally-projected to him, the holy marriage, the icon and baptizing himself in the Jordan river. A test of faith?
That's all i have for now :)
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“Please allow me to introduce myself
I’m a man of wealth and taste
I’ve been around for a long, long years
Stole million man's soul an faith
And I was 'round when Jesus Christ
Had his moment of doubt and pain
Made darn sure that Pilate
Washed his hands and sealed his fate”
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This book almost reminds me of something that Douglas Adams would write. The tone is much more whimsical than I was expecting, although it does have its serious moments as well. The Pontius Pilate chapter was interesting, is there any historical basis for the changes he made? I found it interesting to be sure. Overall very much enjoying it so far.
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He based it off the work of David Strauss and other german philsophers who attempted to piece together a real histroical account of the life of jesus
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I wasn’t expecting it to be a Dark Comedy either. Mick Jagger said “Sympathy for the Devil” was inspired by that book. As for the Pilate chapter is hard to say. Historical Jesus name was Yeshua, and he was probably an apocalyptic preacher who got into trouble in Jerusalem. His “trial” probably lasted a few minutes, real life Pilate probably asked him a few questions, he answered in a way Pilate didn’t like and got crucified, simple as that, crucifixion was a common punishment for slaves and provincial peasants like Jesus.
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I was more interested in the tax man that followed him, was wondering what that was about or if there was ever anything that alluded to that. Judas was changed as well, it was an interesting take. I didn't know that about Sympathy for the Devil, I love that song.
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Oh, I get it. Woland said he was in Jesus Trial incognito. I’m wondering if this “Matthew Levi” guy or this “Pilate’s secretary” fellow is actually the devil in disguise.
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He said he was there unseen so I dont think so, he said he was there for the conversation with the High Priest as well, when it was just him and Pilate
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It's pretty clearly the bird flying around, as all of the sentences mentioning it are so extraneous
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I think that the taxman being just a normal human fricking up the word of god fits better the theme of the novel. Future chapters may bring more info, but so far my impression is that the demon gang doesn't need to push things very far to create a lot of havoc.
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Little is known about Pilates beyond what is said in the Gospel. I don't think there's meant to be much of an historical basis there.. it seems mostly artistic if you ask me.
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It was the tax man and changes to Judas I was wondering about, should have thought more to know it was definitely all made up, lol.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_the_Apostle was Matthew Levi, a former taxman, according to some sources, or maybe it was a different Matthew, but he's definitely mentioned in the Bible.
@neoconshill
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Need to brush up on my gospels lol
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Darn, I need to read the gospels again. So I guess Pilate’s secretary is the devil, Yeshua calls everyone good people, even Ratkiller but he doesn’t say a word about the secretary who’s there.
Reading without knowing the plot is fun.
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"he's always carrying around these notepads writing everything down, I told him to stop" lol
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btw this part gave me a distinct Unsong vibe.
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Yeah btw I just realized that the Matthew - Matvei (the original Greek name btw) connection was not as obvious to English speakers!
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Been a while since I read it so I can't remember it by a chapter to chapter basis but yeshua and pontius pilate plotline is my favorite part of the book
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I was disappointed that the book made Jesus less insane, and the Romans less bloodthirsty, than the gospels record. Professor Satan was an interesting character, I liked when he drove Ivan mad. I enjoyed the beginning conversation about the atheist poem about how Jesus doesn't exist.
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marsey.pink
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Master and Margarita is not a long book, you’re still in time. And if you had read Atlas Shrugged you can handle any length.
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marsey.pink
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nice username
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I reqlly enjoyed it tbh. The premise of a militant atheistic Soviet Union becoming haunted by the Devil and his supernatural entourage and brutally confronted by him is such a fun narrative device. My fav character is Ivan as he's the "model" soviet citizen being directly challenged by the Devil and his freaks like the precentor lol
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One more note here is that Woland is heavily based on Mephistopheles from Goethe's Faust. This is why Woland is frequently called a german. Many of his lines are lines from Faust and there is also a random mention of a poodle which only makes sense when you know Mephistopheles first appears to Faust as a Poodle. (Ive only read Faust part 1)
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I'm sad that I've missed this. I'm gonna try to catch up.
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Join the ping to get notifications!
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It's one of the easiest to read Great Books, so don't feel intimidated
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Better late than never, which my condescending teachers would tell me when I walked into the classroom
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I'm not actually reading the book, but listening to it
. It's my first audiobook, and it's pretty good so far. Voices are very on point
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