EFFORTPOST Reddit ultra soys applied Presentism to past karuat manhood rituals and calls them macho cringe because they have never attained an adulthood growth of character before.

CONTEXT: A TILpost about the kraut manhood trials in upperclass and tertiary educated society called Mensur, being the cause of the modern Hollywoke Nazi badguy stereotype for having facial disfigurements and scars.

https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/18iw7t5/til_nazi_villains_in_movies_often_having_dramatic

This is actually something I knew about. Many of you may be aware of the tired and trite cliche of hollywood badguys like Nazis being facially disfigured. Now the very earliest Hollywood films from 1950s to 1960s had actual basis on fact, that very large amounts of high officers in the Nazi High command actually were facially disfigured, as a sign of manhood and right of passage. The reason being mensur - a variant of dueling without clear winners, where the objective was not to display skill and defeat your opponent, but to demonstrate courage and fortitude, and to be capable of receiving voluntary disfiguring wounds, as well as to be able to receive it.

Oh by the way here is 1 minute video demonstrating the kraut young men in a mensur dual. No, this is not a satire, mensur duals which were taken with deadly seriousness in krautland and eastern europe genuinely did look this r-slurred.

But outside of the absurd comedic looking show of men standing like cowtools a few feet away, wacking each other with sharpened metal bars into each other's faces, this was deadly and serious at the time.

And could have severe consequences for any young men who did not have the guts to partake in this tradition, and would suffer severe social exclusion and dishonour.

Even another redditstrag actually explains it very well:

https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/18iw7t5/til_nazi_villains_in_movies_often_having_dramatic/kdhq3zw?context=8

"That's because the Mensur (in spite of its origins in dueling) isn't supposed to be a physical contest between opponents but rather a test of character for the participants. There is no winner or loser, and the opponents are selected by a committee to be of roughly equal skill. But if a participant flinches or tries to evade cuts by stepping away from his position the Mensur is declared invalid and has to be repeated.

You can think of it as sort of an equivalent to the hazing rituals common in US student fraternities.

Edit: And as to why they fight with their padded sword arm high in the air is because in this starting position (with the arm up and the sword pointing downwards in front of the face) a participant is more or less completely protected against any rule-conforming cuts (ie. cuts to the head while only moving the sword hand and not the arm) if he simply does nothing (eg. if someone freezes during his first real Mensur - during training they use full face fencing masks). Cuts reaching the unprotected parts of the face are only possible while the participant is swinging his sword to make a cut of his own. And not allowing the participants to move their arms during an exchange considerably limits the amount of force that they can put into blows. That's also why they stand so close together, to limit the distance over which the sword can be accelerated before hitting."

Even other redditors actually displays knowledge as to the true objective of what mensur is supposed to be about:

https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/18iw7t5/til_nazi_villains_in_movies_often_having_dramatic/kdgbi8i?context=8

"That's partly due to the fact, that the mensur is less about "Who is the best duelist?" and more about daring to risk pain and wounds.So it's basically about showing that you are a real man whom others can in principle trust should there ever be a real fight."

Finally someone linked a 4 minute documentary that explains why and how mensur came to be, and why it had influence upon the Hollywood Nazi steryotype, which is highly ironic as Hitler banned mensur fraternity duels in order to quell the nepotism of kraut aristocracy against the Nazi movement when he came into power, even though he had nothing against the act of mensur duals itself, but hated the high class which made up a large wing of german high command when the nazis came to power.

Even one Youtube comment sums it up:

Which brings us in todays soystraggotry:

https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/18iw7t5/til_nazi_villains_in_movies_often_having_dramatic/kdgpael?context=8

"Men doing cringe shit to appear macho is as old as time itself. Embarrassing." - reddit turbo Betamale

Now I'm not gonna tell you dramatards that men ripping each other's faces with sharpened rods to pieces was very smart and clever and totally the height of chadliness or some such nonsense, and how we should respect the bullshit traditions of boomertards

But often I see this this insufferable Presentism applied to complex societal forces and events in the past, without even an attempt to understand why they came to be, and merely applying the arrogance of believing only the now and present is right and smart, and to so judge events of the past.

Even other redditors explain the historic and cultural reasons behind why mensur developed as ritual, but this doesnt impress the Beta cucks.

"One can indeed argue that it is embarassing when looked at through the pink glasses of modernity where the (industrial) world is incredibly peaceful. But historically it was incredibly important that men could trust other men with their backs, no matter the situation. And someone who risks injuries in the name of honor in itself will probably also risk injury in the name of the honor of fighting together against the enemy."