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Statist may be even better. It's not burdened by too many associations. (33)
Statists = ๐๐๐๐Libertarians really are the vegans of the political spectrum. (-25)
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He also killed the Socialists. They were among the first people in the camps. (50)
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Yeah, when a fricking moron makes a claim that even a cursory Google search would easily disprove, people tend to get irritated. The same way people get upset when a clown tries to erroneously claim that the American Civil War wasn't fought over African chattel slavery or that the Earth is flat. The Nazis were far-right authoritarians, their entire political and economic ideology was predicated on the existence of racial and social hierarchy. Completely opposite to the doctrine of Socialism/Communism as outlined by Marx and Engels.The Third Reich was about as socialist as the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is an actual democracy. Make stupid claims, get laughed at by the majority of informed people. A favorite Austrian economist and Lolbertarian/AnCap past time it seems. (43)
You're literally making the same mistake that I specifically called out in my post lmao (-15)
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Ok. I feel like I've been most of the reasoning and you've been most of the name calling.The nazis very clearly considered themselves socialists. They even put it in their name. They used socialist tactics to get control, and they ran that country like a socialist country. They also killed the other socialists that weren't exactly their brand of socialism, just like all other socialists do when they get power. (1)
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Biggest Lolcow: /u/DigitialWitness
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Ping HeyMoon if there are any problems or you have a suggestion
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ppl always say hitler couldnt have been a socialist if he killed socialists, stalin also killed communists (mensheviks) and we still call him a commie
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Nazism was not just killing socialists, it existed as a form of anti-socialism that in part came into being as a right wing response to a growing german left.
The idea fascism is actually socialism or a form of leftoidism is like declaring 2+2=10.
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Nah, the name was initially earnest. National Socialists were opposed to the globalist part of communist revolution. Instead of "workers of the world, unite", they wanted "workers of the nation, unite." Very much a dirtbag left kind of thing -- "Socialism, but racist!
"
Hitler however, wasn't a socialist at all. He was a bitter drama kid who was desperate for any sort of power so that people would have to pay attention to his theatrics. He had no ideology beyond narcissism.
Hitler took over the nazi sozis by pretending to be a gay socialist and subsequently rose to a position of political power. But the actual gay socialists in the party got mad that he wasn't being socialist or gay enough. (Hitler wouldn't eat any meat, real or metaphorical.) This culminated in an event called "The Night of the
@Bussy-boy" where Hitler's faction purged the girlies and the gays.
So were the nazis
really
socialist? Stupid question. Have a nice day.
!historychads
Bonus fun fact: "nazi" was originally german slang meaning "r-slur"
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Munich journos called them that way, they always hated the term and never referred themselves as such instead using solely "nationalsozialistische" (comes from "Ignaz" which was a common peasant name).
Hitler and the top NSDAP didn't care for economic policies, class struggle, not even "workers of the nation, unite". Hitler cared solely for racial supremacy and nothing more, that was his obsession. Everything else, including the economy was secondary and just a means to achieve his goals of a Groร Deutschland free of Jews and with enough Lebensraum to ensure its future.
The NSDAP had some NazBol types who were purged from the party as soon as they got into power, and while the top Nazis supported some form of partial central planning, they never had any intentions to get rid of capitalism. Their electoral base wasn't made of blue collar factory workers, but farmers and the middle class so they pandered to them.
!historychads
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Orginal party before night of long katanas had 3 wings. Hitler/himmler wing. Dirtbag wing and cute twink wing.
Cute twink wing was strange. Best way to describe it would be counter revolution agaist socialism. It was about mobilising masses to destroy communism. Yet rethoric was very socialist. But it was used against socialist.
Dirtbag was most socialistic wing of nazi party. Mobilising masses and empowering them. Economic mobility and all that stuff. Plus racial elements.
These two wings were purged and what was left hitler and friends. Middle class of germany that hated old elite and wanted to replace them with themselves. Didnt like social mobility that much. Didnt want to mobilis masses or soviet style revolution.
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they had a really incoherent economic policy, both before and after getting into power, and sometimes the worst of both worlds - like having state-controlled ESKOM type businesses in control of a sector of industry, but only after selling off such a sector to oligarchic businessmen who were nazi loyalists/or highest bidders, they utilized whatever they thought would help them in the short term to gain power and traction until conquest could begin
so at times they were neither capitalistic/socialistic ,but not in the nazbol way
!historychads
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Apartheid era South Africa also had dozens of state monopolies, most of which were privatized by Madiba (ESKOM being one of the big exceptions).
Nazi central planning and statism was mostly pragmatic and directed towards their military goals, they wanted to rearm as soon as possible. During WW2 their suffered from labor shortages due to massive conscription of men, but they also refused to put women to work so they instead made use of millions of conscripted foreign workers from occupied countries (these workers were placed on conditions akin to slavery) to keep the factories running and to increase production.
They were absolutely anti communists and despised the economic left wing, but Hitler's main concerns were always racial, not economical. The man was a complete schizo who thought Jews were going to poison his soup at any moment.
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Taking ownership of the economy and breaking off pieces to your favored people is very much the heart of socialism in action.
You're doing this thing that socialists do:
https://rdrama.net/post/332735/people-hate-it-when-you-point/7620348#context
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did you just quote yourself?
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Hitler was a socialist who hated Bolsheviks because he thought slavs are inferior COOMers who couldn't implement socialism correctly.
That's the most succinct answer.
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im not so sure he was socialist, he pretty much purged the socialist arms of his party by the time he gained greatest power within his own party, and their economic policy was so incoherent, before and after gaining dictatorship in Krautland, that any resemblance to true social policy was by expedience not dogmatic intent
@nuclearshill i don't know the purges part of history well, help me out here
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The head of the SA, Ernst Rรถhm was part of the economical left wing of the NSDAP. Hitler purged him and his goons in 1934 for 3 reasons.
1) the SA wanted to absorb the army, and the generals were naturally opposed to something as asinine as letting some street thugs in charge.
2) Rรถhm supported economic socialist policies which placed the party at odds with it's support base (the middle class and industrialists)
3) Rรถhm was a threat to Hitler, by 1934 he was the only person to call him "Adolf" instead of "Mein Fรผhrer", and used the informal "du" while talking to Hitler instead of the formal "sie".
Other nazbol types like Strasser were also killed.
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Also they were gay lovers and Rohm broke up with Hitler for being too racist.![:marseynails: :marseynails:](https://i.rdrama.net/e/marseynails.webp)
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OH GOD ITS REPEATING ITSELF
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Hitler literally said he wanted to kill all jews because the jewish financial capitalists wanted to control his COOM
Aka leftoid 101. What part about wanting to kill capitalists is not socialism? Eat the rich is literally parroted by reddit coomies on the reg.
Why are you guys saying Hitler was not a socialist?
@pizzashill
@nuclearshill
@TournamentFishingussy-Boy
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He said that while the defending the BASED and TRAD German-Aryan financiers and industrialists. He never intended to nationalize Jewish property, it rather was "aryanized" (aka sold to German businessmen for a bargain price).
Hitler didn't give a frick about banking, his antisemitism was racial, not economical. He literally believed Jews were genetically predisposed to be tricksy and treacherous.
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Well then explain this excerpt from Nazi War Finance and Banking by Otto Nathan, published by the NBER in 1944 before the academia was taken over by leftoids who kept on saying Nazis weren't leftists (like them)
!historychads I have the final and authoritative answer to was Hitler a Socialist cuck or a Capitalist COOMchad
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Pick one
@i_onIy_downmarsey_bad_posts stand with ukraine
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He wasn't which you would have learnt had you read my silky creamy and smooth COOMent in its entirety
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Hotler was a transgender immigrant and STOOD FOR MINORITY RIGHTS.
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Here is an excerpt from Heinrich Hunke's article Ten Theses of World Interest, published around 1944, discussing the planned future of the German economy had they won the war, you r-slurs might enjoy.
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What economic policies could happen if Germany won is beyond discussing. How the economy was actually run during Nazi rule is the main point of COOMing.
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Where is the lie?
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the Nazi conception of the State is the means to protect its race. So Germany's state is about protecting ethnic Germans (Aryans), a fascist Britain would try to preserve the ethnic British, and so on. Pretty much every modern country is breaking this rule through globohomo and mass immigration. So every country is effectively Weimar right now.
Theoretically, if you take MK at face value, this is also why it spurns democracy, because democracy in practice elevates weak leadership, which leads to social degeneration, decay of borders, miscegenation and multiracialism etc.
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!nonchuds we've come full circle with chuds believing nazism was about le secure borders and cultural protection.
The nazi conception of the state was to use it for expansionist wars, ethnic cleansing, and enforcing totalitarian rule.
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weak leadership is a male-brained concept, and I want leadership with some emotional intelligence and ability to multitask, and Its no use making the trains run on time
if you burn 6 million jews and get your shit pushed in by the US, bongs and USSR and its EVERYTHING
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Hmm, interesting.
I learn so much about history on rdrama.net!
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I do, thanks!! I also hate you for stealing my meme, but I will forgive you.
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You're playing word games again like you people always do.![:marseysmughipskorean: :marseysmughipskorean:](https://i.rdrama.net/e/marseysmughipskorean.webp)
"Nazi" != "fascist" unless you're going by the definition of Soviet propaganda for a brief period of a few years before they were allied with the Nazis where they were trying to muddy the waters. Or the definitions of ignorant r-slurs.
Fascism's roots go back to WWI when Mussolini (please for the love of God don't tell me he wasn't a real fascist) broke away from the other socialists to start a faction of nationalist socialists (
) who wanted to get in on the war.
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it's moreso that horseshoe theory has a shade of truth to it.
Fascism posited itself as populist and addressing 'social justice' (i.e. poverty, wages, and equal rights - before that all got associated with shrieking blue hairs). The 'Socialist' moniker and colour red was a combination of 1) goading their commie rivals and 2) competing for the same audience. All of this is in Mein Kampf.
The soc/com -> fascism pipeline is due to both seeking to radically change society and attracting poor young men. Hitler hates the bourgeois class for being rootless and surrendering the Kaiser to revolutionaries.
Can't speak for Benito specifically, but Adolf wrote that this economic policy would be whatever helps the Aryan race prosper, grow, live healthy lives etc and expand its land border. He doesn't prioritise econ for its own sake, mainly out of the belief that finance capital ruins society. He thought the poor/working class should prosper just enough to reduce class conflict, because that got in the way of a unified nation. He didn't want to abolish class at all.
I personally put fascist econ as 'radical centre'. Authoritarianism and cronyism in the economy on its own doesn't strictly = socialism.
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It was like 90% central planning. Sure, they had something like "markets" kinda, and did leave some people in charge of their own businesses (kinda, and except for those they nationalized and gave to others), but they set all prices, controlled the labor market within one union, set wages, and told people where they could and couldn't work. It was very much a socialist society, and I'm tired of pretending it wasn't.![:marseyindignant!: :marseyindignant!:](https://i.rdrama.net/e/marseyindignant.webp)
The "left-right" dichotomy comes during the 60s, when you had tons of socialist academics in Europe wringing their hands and crying that national socialism is so close to their own ideology, so they arbitrarily separated it by calling it "right wing." It's literally a "good faith-bad faith" dichotomy built on their own opinions about how great socialism is. Communism and fascism are two sides of the same totalitarian coin.
Socialists think there's a big difference because they really emphasize words instead of outcomes and actual real world goals of their favored government. For example, there is no progress toward a magical stateless society in happy Marx land, but they say there is; therefore, it cannot be at all like fascism.
!neolibs !historychads, I'm tired of quoting myself in this thread, so here you go.![:marseyreading: :marseyreading:](https://i.rdrama.net/e/marseyreading.webp)
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Hitlerbros we're so back
!chuds
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Chud goals
Literally 0 trans lives matter
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lmao what are you talking about.
each fascist movement is different, yes italian fascism existed, nazism is the only form of facism to reach end stage though.
even then italian fascism was strictly anti-socialist and anti-left.
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Why do you think the german conservative movement levered the nazis into power and were talking about "uniting the right" lmao.
Yeah, thats where "unite the right" came from btw.
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It was literally a "third way" due to the disenfranchisement by communism and capitalism. It was socialist at its heart which caused all sorts of economic issues.
Are you trolling?
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You are outright wrong in so many ways it isnt funny. I can save this comment and book post at you at some point if you want.
No expert on the topic views it this way.
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Have you ever agreed with anyone?
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When it turns out he was wrong (almost every time), he rewrites history to say he always agreed.
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no
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The word "privatization" was literally invented to describe Nazi Germany's economic policies.
Capitalism just means society is structured around a class of people (capitalists) who don't add value to production beyond contributing capital. Doesn't have anything to do with free markets. Germany was state capitalist, like modern China.
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They also implemented a massive expansion of state interference into the private sector pre war as seen in The vampire economy.
The incursion of rent seeking party middlemen into business and the expanded requirement of connections and dependency upon state favoritism to succeed in business.
The incursion of party favoritism for hiring workers under the threat of violence
Rationing of strategic materials through supervisory boards
Implementation of wage, price and production quotas set by the state
State run groups pressured businesses to align with state and party interests
Some industries may have been released from dejure state ownership. But the state destroyed the autonomy of German business, eliminated the free market in many goods and the party used its political power to extract from the private sector. The state never fully handed over control of the businesses to the private sector in actuality.
Allocating capital is the most important job in any country. The alternative is the nations investment decisions (aka its future) being decided by rslurred wingcuck beauracrats or cousin fricking landed aristocrats.
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Market style and capital ownership are two different things.
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socialism isn't really halfway between communism and capitalism. If you have a likart scale where 1 is gommies and 5 is free market capitalism, socialism would be a 2. Nazi Germany would be a 3 or 3.5.
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also like It was anti-communist, but youre missing the obvious point
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it has socialism in the name, how can you refute that![:marseysmughips: :marseysmughips:](https://i.rdrama.net/e/marseysmughips.webp)
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Wrong, Stalin wasn't real communism
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